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jlowery73
2012 DDC Main Event Champion
jlowery73
on 9/17/12

Daily Fantasy Sports for a living?

Anyone else think this could be a full-time thing? Would love to be able to put more time into this then getting home from work and trying to set lineups. If you had investors behind you and won at a decent rate I think this could supply a nice income. Tax season would require a good accountant, however.

Thoughts?

  • britdevine
    2014 PFBC Finalist, Grinders Live Host
    britdevine
    on 9/17/12

    There is certiantly enough money in play every week if you are better than average, to make 50k+ a year profit

  • jlowery73
    2012 DDC Main Event Champion
    jlowery73
    on 9/17/12

    I think so also britt. The way I look at it, there is only 1 month a year (October) where you don’t have pro sports going EVERY day. I am talking about baseball, basketball and football. I don’t think a salary in the 50-70K range would be unreachable if you could put the time in and were a good fantasy player.

  • on 9/17/12

    For the past 12 years Chad Schroeder has supported himself by playing season long high stakes draft contests and sports betting. This year he is spending 180K on entry fees for football. If he can do it I am sure there are others can.

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-09-13/fantasy-football-is-stressful-work-for-former-ameritrade-broker.html

  • jlowery73
    2012 DDC Main Event Champion
    jlowery73
    on 9/17/12

    Yeah, I have seen many of Chad’s Cocktails and Dreams teams over the years. The beauty in daily fantasy however is avoiding season-ending injuries or having to work the waiver wires on a ton of teams. I tried having 50+ season long teams awhile back and will never do that again…way too many hours invested in the waiver work. Plus, there is always the question of season long prizes being paid out…have been in a few bad situations where they weren’t. Makes you wonder what some of those companies do with the money. Daily Fantasy has completely changed the landscape of fantasy sports and you will see more and more players evolving towards that and away from the season long stuff in the years to come.

  • kaetorade
    2013 DSBBC 2nd Place, Ranked 24th Overall
    kaetorade
    on 9/17/12

    I’ve felt for awhile now that dfs, as a ‘job,’ can be a reality. I’m sure many are already making a nice income. The question is, is it sustainable over the course of a year? Over the course of several years? My answer is still YES!

    ps: you know what i hated about seasonal leagues? the potential collusion.

  • Sprizouse
    Ranked: Top 25 Overall, RG Blogger
    Sprizouse
    on 9/17/12

    I don’t see it.

    Too young of an industry and not enough people to get the volume and sustainability.

    Sure the top .5% might be able to generate a very nice return but only favre has eclipsed 1M in revenues and while guys like Beermakers have most certainly earned enough to live modestly, how many Beers are there?

    I know of maybe 5 people I would rely on to do this for a living. Perhaps I personally suck so much I can’t relate to someone profiting 50k a year from fantasy sports… Ah what a life that would be though!

  • on 9/17/12

    What do you think TE best games are to play to be succesful long term, H2H, 50/50’s, or something else?

  • Cameron
    RG Admin, DK $50K Cash Bowl & Rivals Champion, 2012 ROOGSLABBLE Champ
    Cameron
    on 9/17/12

    I’m in the initial stages of an article that interviews a lot of the top, most-profitable players across the industry. I’ve been talking with some of the top players over the past month, and will be talking with more this month to try and get a better feel for this across the industry.

    There are definitely profitable players right now, and a lot of those players out there that are on the right path to being able to make a living (5 figure or more). There aren’t a ton yet who are already at that 40-50k plus annual mark, but they do exist. Some are making more than that amount, but aren’t “full-time grinders”, so you might not be able to call it “making a living”. At this rate however, I’m guessing we’ll see a good amount of people pop-up during 2013 who are making a living doing it.

    I’m looking forward to getting the article out soon now that NFL is underway and things are slowing down on our end. It should profile some of the absolute best Grinders in Daily Fantasy. If anyone is profitable and would like to be featured or interviewed for the article, please PM me on RotoGrinders or email Cameron@RotoGrinders.com. It’ll be a great article for the industry…thanks!

  • on 9/17/12

    @Sprizouse said…

    I don’t see it.

    Too young of an industry and not enough people to get the volume and sustainability.

    Sure the top .5% might be able to generate a very nice return but only favre has eclipsed 1M in revenues and while guys like Beermakers have most certainly earned enough to live modestly, how many Beers are there?

    I know of maybe 5 people I would rely on to do this for a living. Perhaps I personally suck so much I can’t relate to someone profiting 50k a year from fantasy sports… Ah what a life that would be though!

    The only way to get more than 1/2 of 1% of the players to be profitable is to lower the oppressive rake most sites charge. Online poker would have never caught on if only 0.5% could make any real money at it.

  • kaetorade
    2013 DSBBC 2nd Place, Ranked 24th Overall
    kaetorade
    on 9/17/12

    @Lupz27 said…

    What do you think TE best games are to play to be succesful long term, H2H, 50/50’s, or something else?

    It’s been my experience that double ups(50/50s) are best for long term success.

  • sprom
    2012 DSBC Finalist, 2013 DSBBC Finalist
    sprom
    on 9/18/12

    Cam, I must’ve missed your phone call

  • Cameron
    RG Admin, DK $50K Cash Bowl & Rivals Champion, 2012 ROOGSLABBLE Champ
    Cameron
    on 9/18/12

    @jlowery73 said…

    Yeah, I have seen many of Chad’s Cocktails and Dreams teams over the years. The beauty in daily fantasy however is avoiding season-ending injuries or having to work the waiver wires on a ton of teams. I tried having 50+ season long teams awhile back and will never do that again…way too many hours invested in the waiver work. Plus, there is always the question of season long prizes being paid out…have been in a few bad situations where they weren’t. Makes you wonder what some of those companies do with the money. Daily Fantasy has completely changed the landscape of fantasy sports and you will see more and more players evolving towards that and away from the season long stuff in the years to come.

    Somehow missed this while reading earlier today. Good analysis JLowery. Totally agree with the amount of time required for waivers, and the doors opened by daily bc of it. Haven’t read that Bloomberg article yet but will tonight.

    Just out of curiosity, where were you not paid out at?

  • jlowery73
    2012 DDC Main Event Champion
    jlowery73
    on 9/18/12

    Dimesports, WCOFF, Sportsbuff to name a few. Sportsbuff was an odd one because I had won the Grand Prize (and got paid) there 2 years before but they folded up shop a few years back right after the season. There are a couple well-respected legit season long sites out there so I feel for them and their business after what some of these others did.
    Total payments not received from all of the season-long ones are in excess of 6 figures, so yeah it hurts bad.
    I know where the majority of my bankroll will be in the future, and it won’t be in the season long stuff.

  • on 9/18/12

    There are many players who play casually BUT win at a great rate and just make “extra” income on the side. I’m sure if these people started to put in more time and played more volume the #‘s would go up.. That said, I think the reason why the 50K mark is relativel low is because the industry is fairly low, and I think there are a few out there who are really giving this another year or two to weigh their success to see if it’s worth it for them.. Only time will tell.

  • on 9/18/12

    I think the biggest issue would be figuring out how much you spend on other things like bills, car payments, house/rent payments, food, entertainment, health insurance, and 401K. On top of that you have to figure what you will be paying in taxes as well. If you have a bad month or two will you have enough to cover all the other expenses that you need to pay in order to have a decent life. Proper bankroll management and budgeting will be huge, if not you will probably be looking for a nine to five type job quite soon.

    What’s interesting about Sportsbuff is it was run by
    Jeff Thomas who for many years was head of the fantasy trade association. He also ran rapid draft another site that failed to pay.

    The owner of dimesports is now in federal prison. The last contest he ran his uncle won with a cap over the limit.

  • jlowery73
    2012 DDC Main Event Champion
    jlowery73
    on 9/18/12

    Actually he is out of prison now. He was there on tax evasion charges…go figure. It was his cousin who was over the cap in the contest…I called him on it and we went to Arbitration which I won. However, getting him to pay up has been a nightmare.

  • whits23
    2010 FFFC Finalist, 2010 DFBC Finalist, 2011 FFFC Finalist, 2014 DSBC Finalist
    whits23
    on 9/18/12

    No one has mentioned the obvious..if you want to play dfs for a living be an affiliate..if we all spent as much time recruiting players as we do researching stupid splits and weather we would all have more money

  • kaetorade
    2013 DSBBC 2nd Place, Ranked 24th Overall
    kaetorade
    on 9/18/12

    @whits23 said…

    No one has mentioned the obvious..if you want to play dfs for a living be an affiliate..if we all spent as much time recruiting players as we do researching stupid splits and weather we would all have more money

    that makes too much sense and sounds like too much work. we’re also suppose to have fun in the process, right?

  • on 10/12/12

    @Cameron said…

    I’m in the initial stages of an article that interviews a lot of the top, most-profitable players across the industry. I’ve been talking with some of the top players over the past month, and will be talking with more this month to try and get a better feel for this across the industry.

    There are definitely profitable players right now, and a lot of those players out there that are on the right path to being able to make a living (5 figure or more). There aren’t a ton yet who are already at that 40-50k plus annual mark, but they do exist. Some are making more than that amount, but aren’t “full-time grinders”, so you might not be able to call it “making a living”. At this rate however, I’m guessing we’ll see a good amount of people pop-up during 2013 who are making a living doing it.

    I’m looking forward to getting the article out soon now that NFL is underway and things are slowing down on our end. It should profile some of the absolute best Grinders in Daily Fantasy. If anyone is profitable and would like to be featured or interviewed for the article, please PM me on RotoGrinders or email Cameron@RotoGrinders.com. It’ll be a great article for the industry…thanks!

    I was wondering when this is story is coming out? Sounds like a good piece.

  • Cameron
    RG Admin, DK $50K Cash Bowl & Rivals Champion, 2012 ROOGSLABBLE Champ
    Cameron
    on 10/12/12

    @durr5 said…

    I was wondering when this is story is coming out? Sounds like a good piece.

    Thanks! Still lining up a few more interviews with people that should be included. Should be this month though.

  • on 10/28/12

    I’m also looking forward to reading this article. Any more word?

  • on 1/28/13

    @Cameron said…

    Thanks! Still lining up a few more interviews with people that should be included. Should be this month though.

    Was wondering how this was coming along?

  • on 1/28/13

    I think the hardest part is being good across at least 3 if not 4 of the sports and being able to parlay that unto multiple sites.
    I know I’m good at MLB yet i cant crack DS or DJ no matter what I try.

  • on 1/28/13

    @barro said…

    I think the hardest part is being good across at least 3 if not 4 of the sports and being able to parlay that unto multiple sites.
    I know I’m good at MLB yet i cant crack DS or DJ no matter what I try.

    Would you think, if you up your stakes and did less volume that one to two sites would be enough? The bigger sites seem to have tons of games at all levels but again the hardest people to play against.

    Any thoughts on Volume vs Stakes…..to me seems like you play the same people in lower stakes as you do in the higher stakes.

  • on 1/28/13

    My opinion is Volume over stakes. Yea stakes can build up quicker, but can also drop quicker. I try to play about 30 games a night on Joust from $1-$11 & about 5% of my buyins being in tournaments between $2-$22.

    This month on DJ I have gone from a bankroll of $88 to $850, so I think its possible.

  • Cameron
    RG Admin, DK $50K Cash Bowl & Rivals Champion, 2012 ROOGSLABBLE Champ
    Cameron
    on 1/28/13

    @durr5 said…

    Was wondering how this was coming along?

    Ugh. Got put on the backburner…sorry guys. NFL season was beyond chaotic.

    Have a couple solid interviews in the books already with profitable players, and a few more lined up. If you would like to be interviewed for this, just shoot me a private message…would love to include as many highly profitable players as possible.

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