INDUSTRY FORUM

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  • FDRep

    • FanDuel Representative

    Hi everyone, Nik here. We’re excited to share with you a big change to our NBA formatting for this season.

    If there’s one consistent frustration we’ve heard from NBA players, it’s the handling of inactive players. Whether it’s Pop late scratching LMA or a top-secret undisclosed mystery injury, it’s an awful experience when you’re drawing dead before the games even start. We call these events “avoidable zeroes”, and they’re the absolute worst.

    Over the summer we prototyped and tested a few different solutions and one thing became crystal clear – if we were going to make a change, we needed to make sure that the change was a fair change for everyone, and didn’t disadvantage one user segment while giving an advantage to another. I obviously can’t speak for every user, and while I’ve got a very loving (and patient!) wife at home, she’s got a limit to how much I’m glued to phone when we’re together. I’ve got friends who have kids, work nights, love the gym, and a whole host of different reasons why late swap simply doesn’t work for them. The division on the topic on the RG forums alone convinced us that it wasn’t the solution.

    Instead, we’re announcing a simple, yet powerful change: we’re dropping your lowest score. Call it best ball, call it a gimme, call it whatever you’d like. Bottom line, if a player puts up a zero, the score won’t count. Positions stay the same, scoring stays the same; we’ll simply only count your top 8. You don’t have to stay glued to your phone; you can pick that West Coast GTD with confidence and even he doesn’t go, you’re still in the running.

    Give it a try, and feel free to shoot me any feedback: nik.bonaddio@fanduel.com. Good luck!

    - NB

  • dolphinkick182

    @cdenny99 said...

    This is the worst day of the year. Time to start drinking. Thanks FD

    You just started? Man i’m a pace maker!

  • dolphinkick182

    @Cooper08 said...

    I think many who are not happy will have a different opinion after the first week.

    I’ll bookmark this response. Let’s see,

  • dolphinkick182

    @maddysdaddy09 said...

    Is this in effect tonight?

    No, start of the regular season according to an email from the FD rep.

  • jlowery73

    2012 DDC Main Event Champion

    • 2014 FAFC Finalist

    • x3

      2015 FACFC Finalist

    Not in love with this, and here’s my two cents. I think almost everyone will START building their lineup with a min priced player at a bad position. On low game slates you will see a lot more similar builds then ever before.

    Basically, I think you will see tons of similar (or same) lineups which makes me dislike this. I hope I am wrong. Once again, I don’t see how you wouldn’t start out with a min priced player at a thin position. So you essentially are losing a position in your roster build therefore less variance. To me that isn’t good.

  • bigez952

    @jlowery73 said...

    Not in love with this, and here’s my two cents. I think almost everyone will START building their lineup with a min priced player at a bad position. On low game slates you will see a lot more similar builds then ever before.

    Basically, I think you will see tons of similar (or same) lineups which makes me dislike this. I hope I am wrong. Once again, I don’t see how you wouldn’t start out with a min priced player at a thin position. So you essentially are losing a position in your roster build therefore less variance. To me that isn’t good.

    If everyone is going to build the same lineup starting out with a garbage 0 min priced player it should be really easy to be contrarian and take all the money since salary doesn’t = good plays. People are giving FanDuel way too much credit for being experts at pricing so raw points will fall perfectly in line with salary. That isn’t the case and I honestly hope 95% lock into the same terrible strategy and one of those overpriced stars get hurt and the balanced approach wins all the money without ties.

  • Joe1Coal

    @eppy12588 said...

    Please change it back to the regular format, this does not solve anything. Everyone is just gonna gamble that they don’t have a late scratch guy/injury and play a pure punt to maximize the salary for the 8 players that will count. Sure you can say that you hope people won’t do this or will stop doing this after they have their first late scratch paired with a pure punt and they’re drawing dead that night, but they won’t because it will be optimal strategy as long as you don’t have a late scratch or an injury which is rare as is.

    It’s like you don’t understand english. But, you wrote it, so you must?

    “Everyone is just gonna GAMBLE…” Just stop your sentence there and read it out loud a few times.

    EVERYONE IS JUST GONNA GAMBLE. It is a gamble. People are scratched, have bad shooting nights, foul trouble, etc every single night in the nba.

    This is a solution. Don’t like it? Don’t play. I don’t understand any of you complaining about this. If you do not like it, do not play. The end.

  • baseballislife93

    Wow this is absolutely horrible , the way to go is just take a min guy and load up on other 8 now, I loved FanDuel format really sad to see this

  • Joe1Coal

    @eppy12588 said...

    Fanduel, and draftkings for that matter, needs to adopt what Draft does.

    If your player is scratched before tip off u have until tip off of the last game of the night to swap to anyone who is same price or cheaper than your scratched player.

    It’s a very simple solution where the person who was unfortunate enough to have a late scratch is not drawing dead now but also did not get an advantage by being able to change around their whole lineup to account for this injury.

    Draft uses push notifications to notify their players that a late scratch has happened, I dont see why fd and dk cannot do the same.

    It’s like you failed to read what they wrote about why they didn’t adopt late swap. Did you? You might’ve. Go back and look.

  • baseballislife93

    Can they at least keep old format for slate that are 2-3 game like after-hours where games are half he to hr apart

  • Pandamonious

    • 814

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #85

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • Moderator

    • 2020 Blogger of the Month

    @Joe1Coal said...

    This is a solution. Don’t like it? Don’t play. I don’t understand any of you complaining about this. If you do not like it, do not play. The end.

    Comments like these are so shortsighted and do nothing for no one nor does this, just take it, conformist attitude. If people don’t like it they should be allowed to voice their opinion. It’s this attitude that makes people feel like they’re in a prison when we’re supposed to be free. These companies exist because of us. Their goal is to make as many people happy as possible. Obviously they will not make everyone happy. That’s part of business but people want to play DFS and it’s their goal to get us to play on their site. They should want to know what we the people that keep them in business like and don’t like. Let the people speak. Then they can conform or not. If you like it, awesome, but I doubt FD shares your “then don’t play” stance. No one made you read this. Don’t get mad at me because you did.

  • tbird05

    the PG/PG/SG/SG/SF/SF/PF/PF/C format was already kinda rough in smaller slates imo. Imagine this new format with no major injury concerns on 3-4 game slates.

  • yisman

    My opinion is that it’s not the best solution but I think it’s better than what DK did.

    I still prefer swap only for the one player or being able to designate bench/alternate like Draft.

    I have terrible luck with injuries but I also don’t want to play with full late swap.

    People saying late scratches aren’t that common should see my lineups from last season…

  • zline34

    Well I sure hope DK hasn’t changed their format because I’ll be taking my action back there.

  • Joe1Coal

    @Pandamonious said...

    Comments like these are so shortsighted and do nothing for no one nor does this, just take it, conformist attitude. If people don’t like it they should be allowed to voice their opinion. It’s this attitude that makes people feel like they’re in a prison when we’re supposed to be free. These companies exist because of us. Their goal is to make as many people happy as possible. Obviously they will not make everyone happy. That’s part of business but people want to play DFS and it’s their goal to get us to play on their site. They should want to know what we the people that keep them in business like and don’t like. Let the people speak. Then they can conform or not. If you like it, awesome, but I doubt FD shares your “then don’t play” stance. No one made you read this. Don’t get mad at me because you did.

    Did you just make an analogy between playing DFS to jail and being free? Stop. Please.

    FD sent a rep on here to talk to you crybabies about your product being changed. So many people are happy to complain, but then when a solution that is not their solution is presented, they complain some more. The point of saying, “if you don’t like it, then don’t play,” is that no one solution can please everybody. I do not agree with a lot of things FD does, but attempting to solve a long standing problem is a positive thing. This is better than what it was and everyone is playing by the same rules. You’re free to disagree, stomp your feet, hold your breath until your face turns red, whatever you want. But, you just sound like spoiled children and I don’t get it whatsoever.

    I have a full time job where I work between 50 and 75 hours a week depending on a lot of factors. However, I do like playing DFS. So, I do. However, I do not have time to sit around and do late swap strategies, and maybe I lose some money because of that. Maybe I do. I don’t really care, but maybe I do. This is a better solution than late swap for all of the reasons the FD rep stated. People like me who cannot sit by the phone and wonder who is playing and who isn’t at 10:30 at night when I’ve been up since 5am.

    At least let it play out for a week before everyone cries doomsday. It has not even been implemented yet and everyone is crying like they lost their dog.

  • cdenny99

    Hey @joe1coal, if you don’t like hearing people complain you’re probably on the wrong thread—since there will be many complaints here. So you are free to “don’t play here” if you don’t like the comments.

  • Njsum1

    @yisman said...

    My opinion is that it’s not the best solution but I think it’s better than what DK did.

    I still prefer swap only for the one player or being able to designate bench/alternate like Draft

    I think many people would prefer an unlock the scratched player only solution. I asked the DK rep why they didn’t go this route and he implied that it would be very challenging to accomplish this.

    However, the FD rep also said, they didn’t want people to have to be on their phones/computers after lock, so I’m not sure if it’s a technology thing for them as well, or if they wanted a solution that helps combat late scratches where lineups completely lock at first games’ tip-off.

    One thing I don’t understand, is people’s negative reactions to this format who haven’t played it before. If you’ve played it and hated it, cool, you’re certainly entitled to be unhappy.

    I’ve played it, I loved it. People should at least give it a try before knocking it. Yes it adds another layer of strategy, yet it’s not time consuming readjusting lineups all night to account for news strategies, and it also combats many common problems with nba DFS. Late scratch, injury, etc… The new strategies it creates aren’t complicated, and there’s maybe like 5 things or less one can do. The edge savvy players will get will be small. Not enough edge to overcome the sting of an early injury or late scratch, imo, or having to worry about adjusting my lineups after lock.

    I’ll mention again, that I had success with this format after never having played any form of NBA fantasy and not following basketball for over a decade. I literally couldn’t name more than 5 players in the league at the time. I’m not a genius or some whiz kid who’s great with projections either. It really just isn’t that complicated. It’s pretty cool..IMO.

    Anyway, I said I was done posting on this topic, but y’all aren’t so lucky 😎🍔🥓🥫🥦🥞🍾🥗🧀🍰🍔😎

  • chronoxiong

    I am so confused by this change and I dont have time to read through 6 pages to get my answer. So what if we pick an awesome lineup with 9 players filled? The lowest scored player still gets removed still? So this is a best score out of 8 players now? So confusing…

  • tonytone1908

    @noddy said...

    This is huge for injuries that happen during the game and not just late scratches.

    This here. Many late scratches were guys with status up in the air to begin with. What kills many is when a multi-entry player goes all in on a 5k SF that gets hurt in his first rotation. You know your odds and chances when it comes to scratches, you can plan for it. The early game injury to a core player is what bites the hardest. If a max salary guy goes down, you’re screwed regardless.

  • tonytone1908

    @lpdev said...

    This is not a good solution to the problem, it doesn’t help the casual player, but it does change things by adding an element of confusion to the lineup building process. In the past you just build a lineup of the players within the salary cap that you think will score the most overall. Simple and easy for the casual fan. Now the only approach that makes any sense at all is to find a position you want to be dropped and stick a min-priced punt in there. That way you aren’t cutting down the available salary for the spots that actually count toward your score. You’d have to be crazy to think this doesn’t give more of an edge to the top players.

    So many LU’s are gonna be really top heavy. Max salary guys are going to have a lot higher ownership now because everyone will cram the studs in. As I know that’s not always a winning solution. All the good min price value plays will be worthless because everyone will still be on them as well, if not even more so now. Totally balanced LU may be the way to go. Certainly throws a lot of different LU possibilities out there now. I see a ton of ties in the future as well. Thank God for single game GPP’s. I’ll probably stick to them this year, should save me a lot of time on research and LU building and hopefully my love for the Warriors will give me a chance at some money since those late slate GPP’s usually have pretty good prize pools as well.

  • tonytone1908

    @lpdev said...

    Anything that adds a wrinkle to scoring and lineup building process gives pros an edge. The casual player doesn’t have the time and data resources to consider how to best use a throwaway pick for a set of NBA contests. I’m glad you had a positive experience on an old site that used a similar system, but it does give an edge to pros.

    I do think this could bring in some new players that originally their main worry was, one bad pick and I’m toast so why bother. I can see how this would be appealing to a much more casual player.

  • tonytone1908

    @sjs1890 said...

    Yup optimal strategy will always be to take a min priced punt, FD already has the softest pricing in the industry so this just compounds that. They should have just left it how they had it, looks like Draftkings is the clear winner with this news.

    Soft pricing or not, you still have to pick the optimal players for the slate. A 5k guy can put up 50 and a 12k guy can get 20. I seem to do well figuring out what studs aren’t going to get anywhere near value anyways so this may actually HELP me!

  • tonytone1908

    @eppy12588 said...

    Fanduel, and draftkings for that matter, needs to adopt what Draft does.

    If your player is scratched before tip off u have until tip off of the last game of the night to swap to anyone who is same price or cheaper than your scratched player.

    It’s a very simple solution where the person who was unfortunate enough to have a late scratch is not drawing dead now but also did not get an advantage by being able to change around their whole lineup to account for this injury.

    Draft uses push notifications to notify their players that a late scratch has happened, I dont see why fd and dk cannot do the same.

    This right here. No being glued to your phone or computer, but left with a chance of not being completely dead in the water just burning money.

  • tonytone1908

    People should keep in mind, pricing algorithm on FD is affected by ownership %‘s correct? So, if people are just stacking studs, a 12k RWB should get bumped to 15k, right?

    I don’t think it’s going to be as simple as many are assuming to just punt one spot and stack the studs. Would be great for the casual player, but if the algorithms stay true, I just don’t see that happening.

  • SkateFiend

    @tonytone1908 said...

    People should keep in mind, pricing algorithm on FD is affected by ownership %‘s correct? So, if people are just stacking studs, a 12k RWB should get bumped to 15k, right?

    I don’t think it’s going to be as simple as many are assuming to just punt one spot and stack the studs. Would be great for the casual player, but if the algorithms stay true, I just don’t see that happening.

    That’s how I figured the salary would be under this new format. And if (for example) Nicholas Batum is out for 2 weeks, someone like Jeremy lamb should be priced as a starter immediately.

  • tonytone1908

    @SkateFiend said...

    That’s how I figured the salary would he under this new format. And if (for example) Nicholas Batum is out for 2 weeks, someone like Jeremy lamb should be priced as a starter immediately.

    I’m sure we’ll see some times where you might get that one game out of previous salary but even if it’s not a huge jump, say 5k to 10k but even 5k to 7 or 8k could still give some a slight edge for one night.

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