INDUSTRY FORUM

Comments

  • kingofqueens

    • 2019 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • x3

      2016 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/15/sports/draftkings-fanduel-fbi-investigation.html?ref=sports&_r=0

  • srolleDFS

    @WilliamDeBrigham said...

    I admit it is skill for you and players like you… For the large DFS community or new players that see commercials, or if you told your high school buddies to play would it not be strictly luck/gambling for them? So you you consider you and few others or the whole community when deciding if DFS multi entry is a game of skill as a whole. When every single commercial on the radio is DFS saying win a million dollars what do you think new players sign up to try?

    how is it any less of a skill game bc one party has less skill than another? does basketball cease being a skill game just bc the sixers are on the court?

  • WilliamDeBrigham

    @fantasy144123 said...

    Your argument that it is less skillful is the exact argument that makes it more skillful for others. Do you understand that?

    Yes of course, but when considering the law will they consider the 10% that use skill or the 90% that use limited knowledge/luck?

  • BirkG

    This games and poker are very similar that’s bs if the Feds do some boss like stuff to ruin our fun!

  • footballfplyer55567

    @fantasy144123 said...

    I’m referring to the actual post Aguilar made elsewhere.

    I’d be interested in seeing this too. If he did post things like this on the internet, the countdown for his firing is near zero.

  • btwice80

    • 847

      RG Overall Ranking

    @AndThisGuyPeedOnIt said...

    Low multi-entry doesn’t exist at all

    It did for MLB (and I assume it will for NBA).

  • WilliamDeBrigham

    @srolleDFS said...

    how is it any less of a skill game bc one party has less skill than another? does basketball cease being a skill game just bc the sixers are on the court?

    basketball isnt gambling… duh

  • WilliamDeBrigham

    crazy how your defenses keep bring up stock market and now basketball… How can you compare basketball with DFS

  • WilliamDeBrigham

    Everybody will admit this is gambling regardless of whether its skill or not… So comparing it to anything talent driven like basketball makes no sense… The question is whether its a game of skill/knowledge overall and whether you judge that by all players or if a few players are skilled that will be enough to justify.

  • srolleDFS

    @WilliamDeBrigham said...

    basketball isnt gambling… duh

    whether a game is a game of skill or a game of luck does not change because some participants lack skill. how is that controversial?

  • jmo26

    @WilliamDeBrigham said...

    Yes of course, but when considering the law will they consider the 10% that use skill or the 90% that use limited knowledge/luck?

    Your argument is illogical.

    The fact that new and inexperienced players can occasionally cash big in no way disproves that this is a skill game. You are stating that it’s a skill game for the skilled players, because they win a lot more frequently than unskilled players, and a game of luck for the unskilled players because they only win on rare occasions. Do you not see how you are therefore making the argument that this is a skilled game?

    If you put Clayton Kershaw against Ryan Goins, Kershaw is going to win that battle the vast majority of the time. Does the fact that Goins occasionally gets a hit (and perhaps even a HR if they face off enough) somehow make baseball less of a game of skill? Just because Goins got lucky a few times does not prove that baseball is entirely (or predominantly) a game of luck/chance.

  • WilliamDeBrigham

    Do they really lack skill? Or is it too much like gambling that their usual outcome is predetermined? All im talking is multi entry in dfs…

  • kaetorade

    • 2013 DraftStreet DSBBC Finalist

    @WilliamDeBrigham said...

    That’s the point, few people comprehend… do you udnerstand that if few people comprehend thats make it less skill for most?

    If only a small percentage can grasp the logic, that makes it more skillful. Furthermore, only a small percentage of people can even explore such a concept. Naturally, those who fall in either camp are seemingly crying foul. For myself and likely, most people, DFS and fantasy in general has always been about picking player ‘A’ over player ‘B.’ However, for mass entry guys, it’s about understanding different scenarios and who might benefit from those situations. Imagine trying to solve a problem where you have to decipher every possible outcome. That’s the skill in multi entry GPPs. However, fact is, it’s not a practical option for most players. And you know, it’s much easier to criticize than it is to attempt to understand.

  • ATL_Gunner

    I have a real concern that even if nothing comes of the investigation, there is going to be enough stink around this for my Bible Belt state to ban it. With a coming election, taking a hard stance against something that might be easy to paint as immoral could be VERY popular..

    The one thing I think DFS has going for it is that all the major sports associations want to keep it around as it is a tremendous viewership driver.

  • WilliamDeBrigham

    DFS started off the exemption for fantasy football correct? Is their anything at all that can relate DFS multi entry to fantasy football as it was? So if you honestly feel they are similar and it could be defended if we get to that point I believe your lying to yourself… I love DFS and wish to play for many years but im just stating multi entry has taken DFS was to far in gambling direction and I don’t feel it can survive as is… hope Im wrong.

  • yeahthisiscuddy

    @fantasy144123 said...

    Your argument that it is less skillful is the exact argument that makes it more skillful for others. Do you understand that?

    I’m not sure what that other guy is arguing, but I’m saying it’s not skill even for the top players. Ray’s argument about expected value is nice in theory, but in practice it looks like he’s using his bankroll and tons of lineups to throw a bunch of stuff at the wall to see what sticks. I’m sure each lineup is tuned to the ones he most expects to do well, but the wide variety of outcomes speaks to whether that even matters. Either way, I still don’t think this is best for the health of the product long term.

    But Ray is right, we should probably keep this thread about the article.

  • 3rdDFS

    • 35

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #29

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • x2

      2014 FanDuel WFFC Finalist

    • 2014 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    Yet another NY Times article on DFS

    http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/10/15/us/sports-betting-daily-fantasy-games-fanduel-draftkings.html?_r=0

    To give some context: this was the morning after finals.

  • Olhausen

    @Njcop2001 said...

    Last I checked most players don’t have the bank roll to utilize this “strategy”

    So what! I’m a first year small bankroll player who does 10 lineup’s a night. In no way do I feel threatened by players who can put in hundreds of lineups. It’s so obvious who the players are that aren’t good enough to win so they complain about the rules. I guarantee you don’t have to have a big bankroll to win as I started off with a 25$ deposit and grew my bankroll from their. I wasn’t winning at first but I put in the work and improved a ton by the end of the mlb season. Fact is it won’t matter if the big players put in ten or ten thousand lineup’s. If you’re not good you won’t win either way and it’s pretty obvious who that is in these threads.

  • Olhausen

    @WilliamDeBrigham said...

    And while Multi entry in fact does show strategy, it by a larger percentage increases the amount of luck for remainder of the field thus making DFS more a game of luck thank skill or knowledge for 95% of the field… When you say game of skill you have to consider the industry players as a whole from top to bottom, not just the top level… If 5-10% of players are really playing with strategy/knowledge/skill but the other 90-95% are relying on Luck disguised as skill which do you think lawmakers will take into account?

    Then get out of here and stop playing fantasy sports if you think it’s luck.

  • easternmh

    • 2019 Blogger of the Month

    @footballfplyer55567 said...

    I’d be interested in seeing this too. If he did post things like this on the internet, the countdown for his firing is near zero.

    Yeah anyone see that post or find it? I’d imagine it would have raised a lot of questions if it was posted in a PUBLIC forum

  • imaking510

    @AndThisGuyPeedOnIt said...

    I was on Doug Martin, Josh McCown, and the other names you would need to take down a huge GPP, but I don’t have the roll to play every permutated lineup of those players. Does that make me less skilled than the person who won it?

    This is an absolutely brilliant post.

  • WilliamDeBrigham

    Well let’s hope for the best, if it stays as is thats best for all.. Hope im wrong about this.

  • kingofqueens

    • x3

      2016 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • 2019 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    Nicely done, Bryce. Looking forward to the PBS documentary this winter!

    Also, please bring back “_and_schlong” :-)

  • Olhausen

    @rayofhope said...

    You say things like this but there is nothing substantiating it. A player entering 1 entry into a single-entry 100,000 man field has no more/less luck to deal with than a player entering 1 entry into a 200 entry cap field.

    edit: That is unless you’re saying that the field with 200 entry cap will be more difficult because more sharp players…. in which case… so what? it’s a tougher field. there will be tough fields and weak fields, that doesn’t change anything inherent about the luck in dfs.

    You can’t argue with these people rayofhope. It’s clearly sour grapes and people who except to win with little effort or time put in to it. In fact I know it is because I’ll admit I kind of had the same attitude when I was struggling at one point. I may have even voiced my opinion on these threads but not to the extent some others have lately. My point is instead of continuing to worry about how many lineup’s others where entering, I decided to put more time and effort into my own and I would constantly look at the winning lineup’s each night. I was and still am constantly striving to get better and I’ve seen the results from doing that. It really frustrates me when people throw out false information about something they clearly have no idea about. But like I said in the beginning these posts have sour grapes written all over them.

  • Njcop2001

    @Olhausen said...

    So what! I’m a first year small bankroll player who does 10 lineup’s a night. In no way do I feel threatened by players who can put in hundreds of lineups. It’s so obvious who the players are that aren’t good enough to win so they complain about the rules. I guarantee you don’t have to have a big bankroll to win as I started off with a 25$ deposit and grew my bankroll from their. I wasn’t winning at first but I put in the work and improved a ton by the end of the mlb season. Fact is it won’t matter if the big players put in ten or ten thousand lineup’s. If you’re not good you won’t win either way and it’s pretty obvious who that is in these threads.

    We will see what the FBI, Congress, and State Attorney Generals, NFL, MLB, NBA think about all this. I have a feeling they will side with the majority of players who don’t have access to the “strategy” that the sharks employ.

  • yeahthisiscuddy

    @Olhausen said...

    You can’t argue with these people rayofhope. It’s clearly sour grapes and people who except to win with little effort or time put in to it. In fact I know it is because I’ll admit I kind of had the same attitude when I was struggling at one point. I may have even voiced my opinion on these threads but not to the extent some others have lately. My point is instead of continuing to worry about how many lineup’s others where entering, I decided to put more time and effort into my own and I would constantly look at the winning lineup’s each night. I was and still am constantly striving to get better and I’ve seen the results from doing that. It really frustrates me when people throw out false information about something they clearly have no idea about. But like I said in the beginning these posts have sour grapes written all over them.

    Ryazan, is that you?

    Seriously though can we please stop with the “anyone who complains must be a sore loser or losing player” argument? That’s been pretty well refuted in thread after thread.

    Why is it every time something like this comes up it’s the multientry guys that jump to the sites defense?

  • X Unread Thread
  • X Thread with New Replies*
  • *Jumps to your first unread reply

Use our links to sign up and deposit on sites listed in this thread to get these bonuses:

  • FanDuel

    Get 1-month of RotoGrinders Premium for FREE (a ~$40value) by signing up through one of our links!

    Learn More
  • DraftKings

    Sign up for DraftKings using a RotoGrinders link & receive our DraftKings Premium content FREE for 1 month. That’s a ~$40 value! No DraftKings promo code necessary!

    Learn More
  • FantasyDraft

    FantasyDraft strives to put players first, with a mission to “provide a fun and fair experience for all.” To this end, the site has a well-built, easy-to-use interface and a the first of its kind in offering “Rake-Free” fantasy contests.

    Learn More

Subforum Index

RotoGrinders.com is the home of the daily fantasy sports community. Our content, rankings, member blogs, promotions and forum discussion all cater to the players that like to create a new fantasy team every day of the week. Our goal is to help all of our members make more money playing daily fantasy sports!

Bet with your head, not over it!
Gambling Problem? Call 1-800-Gambler