CBB FORUM

Comments

  • dailydimes

    I know Dk and FD have dropped NCAA games, where is everyone playing CBB this season? Looked into Fanpicks but the site looks cheap and their game slate is pathetic with over 40 teams to chose from, most of which aren’t in the power 5 conferences.

  • joe123

    Draftworlds revamped CBB product is very good. They removed the ancient Center position. The salaries are flexible where you have plenty of options. Nothing too crazy jumps out at me in the player pool although there are several bargain players available.

    Fanpicks seems to have more traffic at the time but I have moved my minuscule rake over to Draftworld for the time being. I have suggested a number of things to Fanpicks support and while they have taken some of my suggestions to heart, no guaranteed 50/50s have caused me to flee. You need some guaranteed 50/50 games for low $ players to stay afloat in the ecosystem. I entered about 5-6 50/50s to start the season and I believe only 1 actually ran.

  • SeriousLate

    Hey Scott,

    Thanks for making a run at keeping CBB DFS alive. Having played for several years on Fanduel and DraftKings (primary site was Fanduel), I had a few thoughts that have already been mentioned but wanted to give my take on.

    1st and most importantly is determining slate construction. Fanduel only ran contests if both participants were in the following conferences (someone correct me if I am missing anything): Big 10, ACC, SEC, Big 12, PAC-12, Big East, AAC. On DK, they did one thing I liked, and one thing I didn’t like. DK opened up contests for some of the better Mid-Majors. I know the A-10 and Mountain West would get some run on DK, and I THINK sometimes you would see MVC, WCC, etc. Whatever you do, I would set a limit to the conferences you are going to run. I like the idea of those 10, personally, there is some good basketball in the A-10, Mountain West, MVC, WCC.

    What I wouldn’t do, and you guys currently are doing, is run any contest that includes a low major. Even if they are playing a high major. I personally hated when DK would run out slates with players eligible for one team but not the other. If you have to do that, then it simply isn’t a good game, and just makes the predictability and gamesmanship go down. I would require that both teams come from an eligible conference in order for the game to be played for DFS.

    So for tonight, looking at the primetime slate, you made the following contests available:

    Washington vs. TCU
    Stetson vs. UCF
    Boston U vs. UCONN
    Temple vs. St. Joes
    Purdue vs. Louisville
    Rutgers vs. Miami
    Virginia Tech vs. Michigan
    Middle Tennessee vs. Mississippi
    Green Bay vs. Kansas State
    Drake vs. Depaul
    Western Carolina vs. Marquette
    SMU vs. Boise State
    Jackson St. vs. Memphis

    13 contests. Immediately, games including Jackson St., Western Carolina, Green Bay, Middle Tennessee, Boston and Stetson should be excluded. You could also argue further that Boise St and Drake games be excluded. Either way, you would still have a nice 5-7 game slate to choose from. No reason to push the number of teams. I think the CBB community is used to small slates in December at this point.

    This is also going to hurt getting any kind of casual player. Someone might come on your site interested in playing some of this ACC/Big 10 Challenge games and realize they are WAY out of their element having to understand what Jackson St. and Stetson have available to them. There isn’t the same information made available for CBB that there is other sports. People who play this semi-competitively barely have enough time to do research and keep up with the 80+ teams that would make up the 7 largest conferences, making all D-1 teams a possibility is impossible to keep competitive.

    Further, I would cap the max number of games to pick from in any one day. If i had my way, I would never go further than the top 15 eligible games from Kenpom’s thrill factor list (or whatever comparable system you set up). The pro leagues are so much smaller than college, while a professional slate will never have more than 16 contests, in NCAA you could have massive slates. There has to be some limit made to that.

    Many others have covered the pricing, I will trust you all are working out the kinks to make the pricing competitive and fun for participants. However, deciding how you were going to cover slates and making that openly known to the players is important. Hopefully you are taking these conversations to heart.

    To review:

    Limit the conferences to either high majors or high majors + high mid-majors
    Both teams need to have players available to choose from (personal opinion, I can see others disagreeing)
    Limit a slate to 15 games
    Get the pricing right

  • SeriousLate

    Oh, also… you have players only Center eligible with no Center spot. They are Utility only. Either change all Centers to Forwards, or change one Utility to a Center spot.

    My vote would be to make all Centers, Forwards.

  • JENSGT

    The pricing is way better than it was before…it’s playable. What is surprising to me is how little people there are playing. Are degenerate college basketball gamblers really that rare of a thing?? lol. I absolutely love CBB and while I have little free time with my toddler crawling all over me most days I do enjoy spending my free time researching and building lineups. I feel like if we could get contests going where you could win even $100 would bring the fun factor up so much. I guess we just need more people playing to get to that level. Where is everyone??

    I personally can’t stand NBA DFS and NFL is just clearly not my thing since I never win anything. CBB I won a modest amount last year…so I was really sad to see it go.

  • SeriousLate

    Jen, the answer to the question “where is everyone?” is “giving up on CBB DFS” :(

    I played very regularly for about 3-4 years and didn’t even consider looking into these one-off sites. There just isn’t the publicity for these sites the way there was for Fanduel and DK.

    Anywho, my second day looking over the slates on fanpicks.com. We have a 7 game slate on the primetime today:

    Columbia vs. Seton Hall
    Florida vs. North Florida
    USF vs. Troy
    SFA vs. Arkansas
    Oregon State vs. Mississippi St.
    Montana St. vs. Utah
    Cincinnati vs. Iowa St.

    Today is a classic example of a bad day for CBB. This is a one slate, 2 game day in my opinion. Cincy/ISU and Oregon St./Mississippi St. No slate should include Montana St, Stephen F. Austin, Troy, North Florida or Columbia. Its not worth researching and it isn’t fun to play. We aren’t even going to have much exposure to the Cincy/ISU game (the only one worth watching) because there are so many blowouts on this slate to choose from.

    You also have several slates tonight. You have a slate that DOESN’T include either of the only 2 games worth having. A five game slate with no Cincy/ISU or Oregon St/Mississippi St? Yuck.

    Come on Fanpicks, we can do this! Tighten up the conferences you allow teams to come from, require both teams come from those conferences, and let’s get this right.

    -Serious Late

  • dailydimes

    A few of us stated this exact thing a few weeks ago. It’s incredible that they would run this many slates, I try to look at both sides but just cant stand to reason why they would add these games. I really feel they just threw something together to attract a CBB crowd with FD and DK bowing out and they have no idea how to run those slates. Why 3 utility players? Why 3-4 slates a night of low major games?

    There are a few degenerates still playing, I go H2H a lot with eforsty but no one putting up any stakes to make the games fun. They need to force players into a $5 or $10 gpp to get people playing. Until there is a strong DFS base on the site, run 1 slate and force people to fill a gpp with lower stakes to get the action going.

  • JENSGT

    Agree….they need to do whatever it takes to get some higher paying contests for it to grow.

    Personally I have gone through CFB season and I have no idea what is going on…this forces me to pay attention more so I am ready when tourney time comes. It’s my favorite time of the year!!

  • dailydimes

    I’m with you there, CBB is by far my favorite sport. I figure they have a month to polish the slate before the conference games start so here’s to hoping

  • SeriousLate

    I am surprised that the second tier fantasy sites (looking at you Fantasy Aces) didn’t pick up where FD and DK left off. We have been relegated to sites that, honestly, won’t be around in 2 years. Super bummer, I am still holding out some hope for CBB DFS in the future, but what we are given right now is UUUUUUUUUUUUGLY.

  • JENSGT

    Yeah I will always hold out some hope that CBB DFS goes back to the big sites again one day. Never will I understand why there can be point spreads and gambling on game outcomes yet the DFS is “not good for the athletes”. BS.

  • kantiger77

    I’d really like to see, on Draft World and FanPicks, SMALLER slates. I can’t stand the 15 game slates. I like 3-7 game slates. You can break the games available down into three or four pools.

  • SeriousLate

    Continuing with the analysis of Fanpicks.com slates. Today’s “All” action included:

    Duquesne vs. Pittsburgh
    SIUE vs. Indiana
    Cal State Bakersfield vs. SMU
    St. John’s vs. Tulane
    Alabama vs. Texas

    Interesting slate, probably a 0-3 game slate realistically. SIUE and Cal State Bakersfield should NEVER be on a slate. Duquesne and Tulane could feasibly be on slates though (if the A-10 and AAC get regularly included). Problem today is… there are FOUR slates. Fanpicks… I am much more likely to enter my one lineup into multiple tourneys than I am to create multiple lineups just because one team was left off here or there. We do not need an “All”, “Eve”, “Primetime” and “Late” slate. That is insanity.

    Let’s gooooooooooo!

  • kantiger77

    I completely disagree with SeriousLate. I really like the fact SIUE and CSB are included. I like games like that. I also love the variety of slates – that’s what I’m looking for, I would actually like to see * more* slates of 3-7 games versus these with 10-20 games.

  • Rockythunder

    The problem that I’ve posted before is they still have a problem getting the slates accurate. Just made a roster for the 50/50 early, and tried to post a heads up one with the same lineup. When I checked the games when it wouldn’t post it was because they had added an 8:00 game to the lineups. Simple situation of auditing. Really frustrating when you are trying to add more lineups, and you have to redo everything each time. That and I would like to see the same consistent tourneys each and every day. If you have a standard 2 – 5 dollar tourney, then have it for every slate. I know they are probably doing it this way because they are tired of paying out guaranteed money, but there has to be more consistency. Part of the reason I haven’t played much this week as it seems like things change every day. I understand pricing, and such, but find a common ground and try to stick with it.

  • Rockythunder

    I totally agree with what Serious late is saying. If you name something a Primetime slate for a 1 dollar tourney, then it should be the exact same slate for the Primetime 50/50. Like you I enjoy having access to 3 to 4 slates is fine, and having less well know teams as well, but have some freaking consistency within the slates. After you finish researching your slate, and finalizing your lineup, you shouldn’t have to go back and do more research for an extra 2 to 3 games added on something that is named Primetime as well. Eventually they will get it figured out, or it will go bye bye quickly. They can’t be depending on 20 to 25 guys to keep carrying the site. New people will get turned off when they see the inconsistencies currently exhibited. Just my two cents.

  • SeriousLate

    @kantiger77 said...

    I completely disagree with SeriousLate. I really like the fact SIUE and CSB are included. I like games like that. I also love the variety of slates – that’s what I’m looking for, I would actually like to see * more* slates of 3-7 games versus these with 10-20 games.

    I don’t understand the disagreement. You like having teams like SIUE and CSB, but don’t like having 10-20 games on a slate??? You realize I am advocating that these slates be more in the 3-5 game range right now.

    So you want, rather than 1 slate featuring well known teams on any given night, 4 different slates with slightly different start times each night? Why not just make 4 different lineups for the one slate? What is the appeal of having 4 different slates on one day when there are only 3-4 games that merit any attention? They could be running out the guaranteed 50/50s, tourneys, satellites, etc. all on one slate. You can still make different lineups if you want, but having 4 different slates (All, evening, Primetime, late) REQUIRES a completely different lineup. I don’t see how that is going to help save CBB DFS from the ugliness we have now.

    So now what we DO have, is a sport with little to no research available, no support from the major sites, and 1 or 2 sites with no marketing budget to actually attract players. How is 4 different slates in one evening going to help in this scenario? How is including teams like SIUE and CSB going to help in this scenario?

    I just want to see it work out. In the pros, you have at most 32 teams to keep tabs on for any one sport. In college basketball, if you were to just play slates featuring the Power 5 + Big East, you STILL have 75 teams to track. If we were to include some of the high Mid-Majors (AAC, A-10, Mountain West, C-USA) that adds another 50 programs, so now we are at 125 programs to be focused on.

    There are another 22 D-1 conferences in College Basketball featuring over 200+ teams. That totals 351 schools across 32 conferences. But we are going to be able to grow CBB DFS by including all of them on a ton of different slates? Come on. They gotta clean it up. I like small schools, I spent some time at an Ohio Valley Conference school. The major conferences get the media attention, they get the recruits and players people know, and it creates some semblance of an organized structure. Keeping up with 351 schools might be feasible for some, but it won’t be sustaining for the sport overall.

  • SeriousLate

    And to be clear, when the action is there, let’s roll out 6 slates in a night. Come conference season, it would be awesome to have something like a High Major Slate (ACC, Big Ten, SEC, Pac-12, Big 12, Big East) with 3 slates (All (Max 15 games), Early, Late) and a Mid-Major Slate (A-10, AAC, C-USA, Mountain West, WCC, Missouri Valley) with 3 slates (All (Max 15 games), Early, Late).

    But right now, there aren’t the games to make that happen. January, yup. Right now, there aren’t enough games to support 1 solid slate on a weeknight, let alone 6. The thing that bugs me the most, it just doesn’t feel like any of this was planned out. I can’t stand the idea of “let’s throw as much crap as possible at the wall and see what sticks”. I call this “The Denny’s” Marketing Strategy. The template for this is already there. Whether you played on Fanduel or DraftKings (Fanduel was better), you already have some expectation of how the game is played. What is on Fanpicks right now just isn’t cutting it.

    That being said, the opportunity remains. Put some actual marketing behind the fact they are the place to place college fantasy sports and support that marketing with a genuine plan for optimal gameplay and it certainly creates something for Fanpicks that competing in the pro sports won’t give them.

  • SeriousLate

    To keep beating a deadhorse, one last look at the Primetime slate tonight:

    Cal St. Northridge vs. St. John’s
    Stetson vs. Iowa
    UCONN vs. Syracuse
    Texas A&M Corpus Christi vs. Texas A&M
    Nebraska Omaha vs. Iowa State

    I think I have hammered home my opinion on having some of these teams eligible for play, but my one point today is that there shouldn’t even be a slate. “But Serious Late, why do you care if they run out this slate? If you don’t like it, don’t play it”. The ultimate strawman argument. It isn’t about whether I personally would play the slate (I won’t be playing tonight’s slate), but whether the slate has any merit to being with. I took a look at the Kenpom ratings for tonight’s games:

    Cal St. Northridge (224) vs. St. John’s (112) = gap of 112 spots… not expected to be entertaining
    Stetson (295) vs. Iowa (92) = gap of 203 spots… not expected to be entertaining
    UCONN (80) vs. Syracuse (23) = gap of 57 spots…. 1 game feasible on the slate
    Texas A&M Corpus Christi (194) vs. Texas A&M (32) = gap of 162 spots… not expected to be entertaining
    Nebraska Omaha (142) vs. Iowa State (28) = gap of 114 spots… not expected to be entertaining

    One game that is even in the realm of competitiveness and lo and behold, its the one game that I would advocate ever having a slate. Now since you can’t have a one game slate, the realistic result is to not play games tonight.

    The thing that bugs me about this is that now on top of playing a sport with little to no research available, featuring potentially 350 different teams, we are now left to weigh the blowout factor in each and every uninteresting game being played. Who gets up 20 first and rests their guys? Did anyone tweak an ankle that would have been good enough to go against a comparable level of talent but are being rested because they are facing a cupcake? Who will benefit the most on these non-competitive teams once the starters on the quality teams are pulled?

    Nonsense on top of nonsense… the current state of CBB DFS.

  • JENSGT

    Is there any way to add a bonus for double double / triple double? It’s fun to keep an eye on the stats and root for your guy to get those last two rebounds or whatever it is when there’s a bonus.

  • JENSGT

    Burton for ISU only 10% owned tonight. Surprising.

  • JENSGT

    Wow ok I never complained about too many games on a slate but tonight is crazy. Yesterday I pulled up a Tuesday contest to see what games were on so I could start to do my research and there was a 7game slate. Now I don’t see that and the contests have 25 games in them? I don’t have time to research that many games. This would be a step in the wrong direction I think.

  • kantiger77

    My issue is not any select game, I have no problem if they have those or not. I would not have any issue if they removed games to create smaller slates, that would be fine with me. Tonight, on both DW and FP, they have gigantic slates of 15 games or so, and it just becomes a bit of a lottery.

    Yes, I’d like to see them create multiple slates of 5-10 games. No slates over 10 games. It takes forever to sort through 15 games.

    I don’t like to do more than one entry or two in any one contest, anyway.

  • SeriousLate

    I think we all agree on tonight. :)

    There are some good games that could feasibly fit into the structure discussed and still create several slates. If Fanpicks were to run out games just from the top 9 conferences (Big Ten, ACC, SEC, Big 12, Pac-12, Big East, AAC, A-10, Mountain West), we would have a great slate for tonight:

    All
    -Houston vs. Arkansas
    -Purdue vs. Arizona St.
    -Villanova vs. LaSalle
    -East Carolina vs. Virginia
    -Fresno State vs. Marquette
    -Texas vs. Michigan
    -Florida vs. Duke

    Early
    -Houston vs. Arkansas
    -Purdue vs. Arizona St.
    -Villanova vs. LaSalle
    -East Carolina vs. Virginia

    Late
    -Fresno State vs. Marquette
    -Texas vs. Michigan
    -Florida vs. Duke

    That is a 7 game slate for the “all”, a 4 game slate for the “early” starting at 7 pm and a 3 game slate for the “late” starting at 7:30 pm. Boom. Boom. This slate looks a lot more fun than anything being put out there right now.

    *I was gonna do the top 10 conferences, assuming a major conference like C-USA would be the tenth. But wow, C-USA is AWFUL this year. Check out the Conference RPI rankings:

    http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/bracketology/conference

  • JENSGT

    Yep this should totally be available.

  • dailydimes

    ^^ Figured the slate issue would have been worked out by now, as you mention this is a rare non-conference night to have a strong slate or two. You would think that by the lack of players on the site, they would make an adjustment. There was a guy on here that was asking for feedback a few weeks ago but he hasn’t posted since.

  • X Unread Thread
  • X Thread with New Replies*
  • *Jumps to your first unread reply

Subforum Index

RotoGrinders.com is the home of the daily fantasy sports community. Our content, rankings, member blogs, promotions and forum discussion all cater to the players that like to create a new fantasy team every day of the week.

If you or someone you know has a gambling problem, crisis counseling and referral services can be accessed by calling 1-800-GAMBLER (1-800-426-2537) (IL). Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (NJ/WV/PA/MI), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (CO), 1-800-BETS OFF (IA), 1-888-532-3500 (VA) or call/text TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN).