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  • srolleDFS

    crazygabey was interviewed in the latest new york times hit piece. he said that what was happening between some players of varying skill levels was akin to rape (and pillaging). when someone loses $5 in dfs they end up without that $5. nothing else happens. they may have to scale their next bar tab back to $45, or maybe suffer some other inconvenience of being $5 poorer. when someone is raped, something much much more signifcant happens. the two are not comparable, and its not ok to triviaize rape by comapring them.

    maybe gabey thinks they are? maybe he hasnt actually ever thought about the words he uses? i dont know but its offensive.

    Link to article: http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/06/magazine/how-the-daily-fantasy-sports-industry-turns-fans-into-suckers.html?_r=0

  • tonytone1908

    @eKing said...

    There are more than a few users out there who are using scripts to auto-scoop zero to little win users in h2h on FD. This is one of the biggest problems in DFS, but often overlooked cause everyone is too busy worrying about “max” entry gpps. Just cause the issue doesn’t apply to you directly (same for me) doesn’t mean we should turn a blind eye and let it continue.

    There needs to be restrictions on H2Hs and 3-10 man leagues. Yes, one could have 10000 wins and 30000 losses which would make FD wins a little useless aside from noticing experience (which doesn’t always translate to “pro”). Someone could also have 100 wins with a 100k in profit and therefore should be unable to classify as a “beginner”.

    FD needs to apply their internal data or give users more options, such as the ability to apply their our own user-restrictions within their games….. and on a personal note, I strongly dislike the same user having the ability to join all of my 3-mans. One per person is fine.

    You’re right, most get distracted with max entry when the main worry seems to be H2H scooping.

    Even if the H2H’s didn’t get auto-scooped, they’d still more than likely get scooped by people who are better than them. Scripts or not. People are pissed because the pros get them before the semi-pros do. They’re mad because someone else got to the same people first that they want to protect and keep around. WHAT!? You’re mad because the people you want to keep around got beat by somebody other than you? Wowwwwwwwwww. Seriously? You can say that with a straight face?

    The same people that are worried the fish will leave are only mad because they didn’t get them first. How in the hell in your right mind does that make sense?

    So guess what? FIND A WAY TO GET THEM FIRST! Somebody else found a way before you and that’s somehow unfair? GTFOH. Go find your own way then. Oh wait, you want the sites to give you the ability to cheat the fish as much as the sharks do. OK. That makes sense.

    You want to win? FIND A WAY TO WIN! Don’t get mad because someone figured it out before you. Don’t get mad because someone figured it out already, you know there’s a way to do it, yet you don’t try to do it yourself because you’re too lazy. Man up and admit you don’t want to put the time or money or effort into it and complain because someone else did.

    Every single one of you would have done the same thing these guys are doing if you had thought of it first. Even if you didn’t think of it first you’d see that it works and do it yourself, no? You see what works. Why are you mad someone else figured it out and you didn’t?

    Why do people assume that they are always going to lose because they are playing a pro H2H? They’re not always right, they get things wrong sometimes too. What happened to any given sunday? What happened to, if you flip a coin a million times it’s not going to come out exactly 50/50? I’ve seen some pretty ridiculous lineups take down tournaments. Did a pro make that ridiculous lineup? Hell no! Do the pros win every night? Hell no! It doesn’t take a pro to make a winning lineup, it takes someone who’s willing to take risks.

    I’ve seen some lineups win tournaments that if you looked at them before lock you would have said no way in hell can I play that lineup. But you don’t need to be a pro to make that lineup. It could have been a total idiot making that lineup. But he made it without looking at the spreads, or the over under, or projections, or spreadsheets or game logs, or bots or scripts, and guess what? He still beat the guy that had projections and spreadsheets and bots and scripts. He took chances we don’t take. Hell, I even went so far once as to accuse the sites of filling remaining spots in tournaments with crazy ass lineups on the off chance that it came in 1st or anything high and they’d save themselves a top prize worth of rake. The same people crying foul now are the same ones that laughed me off back then. Somehow it wasn’t strange back then to think that a guy with 4 total wins in 3 years of playing would take down 100k top prize. Riiiiiiigghhttt.

    I also had the concept of players being ranked according to their play and winning ability where the sharks have to play the sharks and the fish play the fish until they get better and have to play better competition but I got laughed out of the building on that one as well. I mean, isn’t this exactly what you people want? I get that concept I just don’t understand why it was considered a joke back then but it’s a priority now?

    So all the programs don’t mean SQUAT unless everything falls your way. You can prepare and research and study and project all damn day long. A last minute injury or two can ruin every single one of a pros lineups and make yours immensely better.

    I really wish some pros would chime in here on how much money they actually lose putting into the prize pools that we losers somehow win once in a while. If people understood how much these guys have contributed to their personal winnings they wouldn’t cry about it.

    If you’re worried about H2H’s on the big sites you could go to smaller sites where that doesn’t happen. But again, there’s no guarantee you’re not just going to get beat there too. So either continue to get beat, get better, or stop playing. We’re all grown, we can all understand that concept.

  • CrazyGabey

    @bowens1984 said...

    I hope no one listens to any show that would have Gabey on, he is clearly only interested in promoting himself, this industry made him and he sold out the first chance anyone tried to interview him for an article

    You are delusional. Someone must have forgot to cut my check because I can’t seem to locate what I sold out for.

  • CrazyGabey

    @emac said...

    Pillage and Plunder would have shown even more of a vocabulary and better alliteration…but alas, it would not have been nearly as effective click-bait, sadly.

    I contributed quotes. I had no control over how the piece was marketed. Ironically, the constant tweets and comments about “rape and pillage” likely contributed to more people being “triggered” by those words.

  • tonytone1908

    @CrazyGabey said...

    I received far more attention each day when I hosted a show with thousands of viewers. How is this even a theory? I wanted 500 angry lunatics spewing venom all over my timeline? As opposed to hosting a live show? C’mon you guys. Yes I’m brand-conscious, and yes I have a background in social media marketing. That doesn’t mean I’m clinically insane.

    Gabey I love you man as a person and a dfs semi(?) celebrity. I’ve always enjoyed your shows even if they went off topic or not. I enjoyed your thoughts and insight in spite of and maybe because of your ability to look at things in ways others might not. I appreciate your comments and encouragements you gave me on a reddit thread I posted once. I was close to giving up and I’m glad I didn’t because things became much more profitable for me after your posts. I didn’t get rich but things definitely turned around for me after that. Without you I may have given up and I thank you for that.

    I may not agree with you 100% but that’s fine. I applaud you for taking a stand on something I know you care so much about. Sorry that such an inane phrase pulled it off topic.

  • tonytone1908

    @CrazyGabey said...

    I contributed quotes. I had no control over how the piece was marketed. Ironically, the constant tweets and comments about “rape and pillage” likely contributed to more people being “triggered” by those words.

    Yeah, everyone assumes you had complete and total control about how that article was written apparently. Guess they thought you would have final edit on the article?

  • wrr954

    @ActionJunkie said...

    We have matchup blockers AND single-entry GPPs or 50/50s/double ups.

    Seriously what else do you want? MAYBE there are small tweaks, but there is absolutely no systemic problem.

    If you suck, you will lose. NO ONE is entitled to winning or playing against fish. You don’t think those that do this for a living fret about playing against hard competition? It’s the nature of the game. You don’t think that alot of these “Pros” started out with bankrolls of ~$100? They did.

    That article wreaks of a hit-piece or attention-whoring. Professional sports, entrepreneurship, and anything remotely competitive caters to those that are better than others. That’s how life works, folks. Make your choices and live with it.

    Quit making sense. You’ll anger the simpletons.

  • wrr954

    @RangerC said...

    There’s a massive edge.

    Here’s an example from this year – Leonard was scratched from the Spurs lineup and Kyle Anderson was starting at min salary (this was confirmed after main slate locked but before express/turbo slates locked). I edited my turbo LU on DK and put Anderson in. He hit for 30 pts or so. My LU finished around 100th in the $3 sharpshooter, and maxdalury had about 70 LU in the top 100 above me. It wouldn’t be possible to handcraft and enter 200 Anderson LU in the 30 minutes before tipoff, but with a LU generator/script you can just lock Anderson, generate top 200 variations, and have the script replace your former 200 optimal LU.

    FanDuel allows players to do mass changes on rosters. If Player A is injured, I can change him out of my 20 lineups with Player B in a matter of seconds.

    What’s your point?

  • Putz

    @wrr954 said...

    Quit making sense. You’ll anger the simpletons.

    When did fanduel add a matchup blocker?

  • Putz

    @wrr954 said...

    FanDuel allows players to do mass changes on rosters. If Player A is injured, I can change him out of my 20 lineups with Player B in a matter of seconds.

    What’s your point?

    But what if I have 500 Different lineups and player A is on all of them? What if player B is a higher salary than player A so I can only swap him on 200 lineups. What if player c is a lower salary but it won’t allow me to swap because it would put me over the 4 person per team limit on 50 hours of those lineups? Player d ….. All this need to be done 5 minutes before lock since news just broke.

    You sound like you never multientered with different lineups. Play the quarter arcade, it’s not easy doing it manually even with 50 different lineups.

  • FunkyColdModella

    @WhiskeyTavon4 said...

    What is your source for this statement. Would love to see the evidence of this. The DFS industry has had a vastly uneven playing field in numerous ways slanted towards high bankroll players since I started playing in 2010. The last 6 months worth of events is nothing different than what has happened since the inception of DF. Despite this uneven playing field the industry has expanded beyond comprehension and each subsequent season shows higher prize pools, more live finals, more sites in general and at least from my personal perspective the ability to get down as much money as I could ever want every night.

    Well, not only by the personal observations of people (as stated here) and myself that contests aren’t filling as fast, but there are states where it’s not offered anymore. Common sense SHOULD tell you that alone would indicate the number of players has gone down.

    Just because you’re still able to play all you want is NOT indicative of DFS continuing it’s growth. I wouldn’t expect any of the DFS companies to release any information that shows the number of players dropping off for fear of scaring off investors.

  • tgowen

    • Blogger of the Month

    People are upset by the words Gabey used in the article, but go about their day constantly engaging in conversations where people do their best to humiliate and degrade other individuals on this forum every single day.

    It may not have been the best choice of words, but don’t act like the actions people have on this site are any better.

  • firesouth72

    @tonytone1908 said...

    Gabey I love you man as a person and a dfs semi(?) celebrity. I’ve always enjoyed your shows even if they went off topic or not. I enjoyed your thoughts and insight in spite of and maybe because of your ability to look at things in ways others might not. I appreciate your comments and encouragements you gave me on a reddit thread I posted once. I was close to giving up and I’m glad I didn’t because things became much more profitable for me after your posts. I didn’t get rich but things definitely turned around for me after that. Without you I may have given up and I thank you for that.

    I may not agree with you 100% but that’s fine. I applaud you for taking a stand on something I know you care so much about. Sorry that such an inane phrase pulled it off topic.

    Ditto.

    When I went full degen-mode and was going through a real bad time Gabey took the time to type out some great advice and wish me well. No self-promotion or referral links, just a guy being helpful and kind to some other guy he doesn’t know. Thanks again for that, Gabey.

    All this vitriol towards Gabey over his choice of words is ridiculous. I’ve had a published interview and as the interviewee I had no control over what the author wrote. The title of my article was super dramatic and not accurate at all. Some of my quotes made it into the article unsullied, some were constructed with phrases I’ve never said in my life. There is a possibility this also happened to Gabey.

  • srolleDFS

    @tonytone1908 said...

    Your mama wears army boots. Now let’s talk about how stupid that comment is and miss the whole point of the thread completely some more.

    nah. i made a thread and titled it “crazygabey and rape culture” because i think thats important. other people gave their opinions. you might think its trivial. and thats kinda my point. using the word rape like that does make it trivial. “he jewed me” is also was an idiom. its not really ok to say that for what i hope are obvious reasons. just because something has been said in the past doesnt make it ok. the past is full of alot of really bad shit. our language shapes how we interpret the world. and the reality is that many men think of rape as more as source material for jokes, or in this case some deluded attempt to sound educated (massive fail) than what it is.

    the mods changed the thread title for reasons i dont understand. but your discussions of scripts are technically off topic. as has been noted many times before, gabey merely repackaged things he read on rg. he didnt say anything original, and is mainly trying to promote himself and his long-suffering brand (he refers to it as his persona, i believe). i dont think thats really significant. the only part interesting is his attempt to pivot into this bizarre folk hero persona after he lost his credibility as a dfs “pro” as people realized his picks were garbage, even tho his delivery was nice. it will be interesting to see how this ends for him.

  • FunkyColdModella

    @tonytone1908 said...

    No way. You can slow it down, but you’ll never stop it.

    If that was true they would have done it from the beginning and they didn’t obviously. Yes, people eventually got permission but they didn’t always have it.

    lol………..

    There are none so blind as those who will not see.

    Why would sites want to limit scripting as it would inhibit large volume players from entering more thereby increasing the rake?

    With that in mind, only pressure from the other 98% of users NOT using scripts or Govt. Regulation will they ever change.

  • srolleDFS

    @CrazyGabey said...

    I contributed quotes. I had no control over how the piece was marketed. Ironically, the constant tweets and comments about “rape and pillage” likely contributed to more people being “triggered” by those words.

    have u considered taking responsibility and apologizing?

  • FunkyColdModella

    @Gotembaseball said...

    Why are people against transparency and the removal of scripts and scrapers. WHY…… Someone please explain why you’d be against that.

    I guess for the same reason people are opposed to Social Security reform. They’re given just enough to get by while not realizing the system is flawed and they could have so much more if the system was better.

  • FunkyColdModella

    @firesouth72 said...

    This is a competition! These things give some players a competitive advantage. Anyone can use them too if they put forth the effort, or not

    I’m guessing you’re a Patriots fan?

  • firesouth72

    @FunkyColdModella said...

    I’m guessing you’re a Patriots fan?

    Redskins, but I smell what yer cookin. It’s a bad comparison you’re making imo.

    Again, if the top 1% are using these tools, why aren’t you?

  • WhiskeyTavon4

    • 594

      RG Overall Ranking

    • x2

      2014 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2017 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    @FunkyColdModella said...

    Well, not only by the personal observations of people (as stated here) and myself that contests aren’t filling as fast, but there are states where it’s not offered anymore. Common sense SHOULD tell you that alone would indicate the number of players has gone down.

    Just because you’re still able to play all you want is NOT indicative of DFS continuing it’s growth. I wouldn’t expect any of the DFS companies to release any information that shows the number of players dropping off for fear of scaring off investors.

    So to summarize you have zero evidence to back up your statement other than yours and others personal observations. The entire point was that nothing has really changed in regards to DK and FD catering to big bankroll players since their inception and it has never inhibited their growth. Moreover, number of players is totally irrelevant even if it has taken a slight hit due to legal troubles in some states. Total handle is the more important thing. Investors dont care about a slight drop off in numbers of players. It is the same in the casino industry. It is far more about quality than quantity. A user/player who plays 10k per day or even 1k per day is infinitely more valuable to DK/FD than 500 average players and their actions have borne this out since their inception.

  • 2021Labs

    @TehSharp said...

    The funny thing about everything Gabey said and this whole discussion is that most of it’s a simple problem to solve. Just limit the sharks from entering lower stakes GPPs, 50/50s and H2Hs, (I’m sure the sites could limit players with six and seven figure earnings from entering contests less than $20) and offer more single entry tournaments. Simply cater to the lower stakes players as much as the sites cater to the sharks, because you need the fish to continue having a business model. Am I the only one who thinks would solve 90 percent of what everyone is pissed about?

    Nope, not the only one by any means, its what i created the thread about several days before this story broke. And I didnt even talk about under $20, I said $5 and below. In my opinion, its a way bigger issue than scripting, and looks a lot worse in the eyes of those looking for reasons to ban DFS in their state.

  • frquis

    @srolleDFS said...

    nah. i made a thread and titled it “crazygabey and rape culture” because i think thats important. other people gave their opinions. you might think its trivial. and thats kinda my point. using the word rape like that does make it trivial. “he jewed me” is also was an idiom. its not really ok to say that for what i hope are obvious reasons. just because something has been said in the past doesnt make it ok. the past is full of alot of really bad shit. our language shapes how we interpret the world. and the reality is that many men think of rape as more as source material for jokes, or in this case some deluded attempt to sound educated (massive fail) than what it is.

    the mods changed the thread title for reasons i dont understand. but your discussions of scripts are technically off topic. as has been noted many times before, gabey merely repackaged things he read on rg. he didnt say anything original, and is mainly trying to promote himself and his long-suffering brand (he refers to it as his persona, i believe). i dont think thats really significant. the only part interesting is his attempt to pivot into this bizarre folk hero persona after he lost his credibility as a dfs “pro” as people realized his picks were garbage, even tho his delivery was nice. it will be interesting to see how this ends for him.

    Nothing personal here, but you’ve got hold yourself to higher standard of writing if you want to make threads about the uses of a word. You consistently have poor grammar and punctuation, which is going to detract from people taking your opinion seriously. Also, for the love of god, use all those DFS winnings you have to buy a keyboard with a shift button. It will help your messaging in the long run.

  • JHols1nger

    @srolleDFS said...

    the only part interesting is his attempt to pivot into this bizarre folk hero persona after he lost his credibility as a dfs “pro” as people realized his picks were garbage, even tho his delivery was nice. it will be interesting to see how this ends for him.

    Say what you will about Gabey’s persona but his MLB analysis last season was elite (specifically his pitcher breakdowns) and played a large role in me having a successful year.

  • FunkyColdModella

    @firesouth72 said...

    Redskins, but I smell what yer cookin. It’s a bad comparison you’re making imo.

    Again, if the top 1% are using these tools, why aren’t you?

    Because I’m not operating with the capitol they’re using and my number of lineups are manageable manually.

    Also, I guess that’s a line I’m not willing to cross. I’ll stay in the camp that advocates change for the betterment of all than join the “forced fornication” efforts ( :) )

  • detroittigers44

    This thread has gone down so many different rabbit trails its hard to keep track of where things stand…

    CrazeyGabey, I enjoyed your work here at Rotogrinders, most entertaining of the bunch for sure. I respect that you are taking a stand against some of the things that you think don’t make sense.. Someone has to be the voice of reason and those people generally aren’t treated with open arms from everyone.. The problems with this industry that were highlighted are legit, I don’t think anyone can argue that.

    How’s this for a possible solution.. Sites need to determine a way to classify players as “pros”. Give them some sort of notation on the site once they have reached certain criteria, maybe its just shear number of wins, profit, ROI, not sure exactly on that..But it seems like transparency is what people seek. This takes out the “oh shit, I am playing a top 5 overall player in the world and had no idea” factor to unknowing new players. Most low stakes players are going to avoid these guys like the plague, but it is what it is… Along with being classified as a pro, you have some restrictions on what you can enter in low stakes games. Maybe severely limit mass entry for those players at the $1 and $2 level. Let new players and newbies battle it out in those big tournaments. They are still hard as hell to win regardless. Let them mass entry the heck out of higher stakes, it has to be that way otherwise the sites won’t exist.

    Now distinguishing what it takes to be considered a true “pro” is what you would need to figure out.

    I know plenty of people blow smoke on here about them being a pro, doing it for a living, how much they make, etc…

  • srolleDFS

    @JHols1nger said...

    Say what you will about Gabey’s persona but his MLB analysis last season was elite (specifically his pitcher breakdowns) and played a large role in me having a successful year.

    i disagree.

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