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  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    Myself and Jake Brown (Vershutyle) have been working on a DFS players bill of rights which covers the biggest issues confronting players. (csv, matchup blocker, scripting, data equality, entry limit standards). We are keeping in mind that these are for profit corporations that need to make money. The goal is to hammer out the language and get as many players to cosign to it, then present it to the CEOs of all the DFS sites.

    We don’t claim to have all the answers. We feel that the formal presentation of what we as players would like is the most practical way to impact change. We are open to hear everyone’s opinion.

    I will post a draft of the document here and on all dfs forums I can find.

    FCK

  • Njcop2001

    I would suggest after you complete this memo you should try to contact Michael Mukasey and the law firm Debevoise & Plimpton. These are the people FD has hired to evaluate their patterns and practices. I’m not sure how much this firm knows about DFS so some outside information may help them ask the right questions.

  • PJGuin23

    DFS Tax Guru

    Good start would be an Individual caps of entries on a percentage basis of entrants. Example 0.1% cap of 383,333 in a GPP pet individual of 383 entries. Higher percentages for lower number of entrants on.a sliding scale.

  • lggarruto

    • 362

      RG Overall Ranking

    I think a cap percentage wise or just a straight number of a certain amount is good. I definitely would not play if it was straight single entry. I also do not do 100 plus teams. I have done 50 + before.

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    Here is a link to the working draft. Again this is a first draft.

    https://docs.google.com/document/d/18pEZmA4_9ZDnCyUpsPNLpxIMDK-QORsNhrhIOdNarF0/edit?usp=sharing

    FCK

  • ColonialRampage

    I think you need to build a consensus among interested players before writing this and get input first. You’re much more likely to get broad support later if you do it that way.

    Also, you may find someone with some writing talent willing to compose this, because if your presentation isn’t good your message won’t matter.

  • nvalencia30

    • x2

      2014 FAFC Finalist

    • 2015 FAWBC Finalist

    I would love to see DFS sites get out of the content game, flooding our inboxes, fostering lineup overlap, and not making new players learn for themselves. I understand they do it to generate new interest, but they should stick to the games and leave the content to others.

  • theseige

    • 2015 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • x2

      2016 DraftKings FBBWC Finalist

    @nvalencia30 said...

    I would love to see DFS sites get out of the content game, flooding our inboxes, fostering lineup overlap, and not making new players learn for themselves. I understand they do it to generate new interest, but they should stick to the games and leave the content to others.

    A good idea but it won’t happen

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    @ColonialRampage said...

    I think you need to build a consensus among interested players before writing this and get input first. You’re much more likely to get broad support later if you do it that way.

    Also, you may find someone with some writing talent willing to compose this, because if your presentation isn’t good your message won’t matter.

    You have to start somewhere. We dont expect this to be the final document. You need a jump off point.

    Also open to anyone willing to help us write it.

    FCK

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    @nvalencia30 said...

    I would love to see DFS sites get out of the content game, flooding our inboxes, fostering lineup overlap, and not making new players learn for themselves. I understand they do it to generate new interest, but they should stick to the games and leave the content to others.

    I agree with this, but I think we are trying to stick to things that are somewhat slam dunks. But Im open to it if people feel strongly about it.

    FCK

  • shark61350

    Awesome! I actually posted the same idea yesterday but the moderators decided to lump it in the DFS leak thread.

    “With the certain changes that are now certain to be coming to Daily Fantasy Sports & industries built around them it’s a perfect moment for we the player to get out “ahead” of this as well.

    We can help educate & inform these providers as to what we want to emerge from this “scandal”.

    What is a perfect DFS environment?

    What should be changed?

    What is working?

    Let’s help shape the narrative.”

  • Geauxgonzo

    Superb idea. I hope this makes it’s way to the eyes of those who can impact change.

  • eddiemunstor

    Love the idea and the suggestions you list. Of course the sharks will be by poo-pooing this for fear it will cut into their food supply.

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    This is a chance for players to have a part in the process. If people choose not get involved it becomes hard to complain about what landscape we get.

    Fck

  • iconfantasyJoe

    honestly I feel like this is the best thing that could have happened to the industry. It finally opened up a real conversation that many players have been trying to have for years with fantasy sites. I have seen countless threads regarding scripting, multi entry abuse (their term not mine), sharks eating the ecosystem, etc etc and finally it seems as if real change will come of it.

    However, this is all happening in a reactionary fashion, instead of a proactive fashion.
    Had the conversation been opened seriously when these issues were addressed (as it should have), it never would have come to this.

    I hope we can take this is an example for the way we operate in the future in this industry, because no doubt other problems will arise that need fixing. Let’s just try to be a bit more open minded on solutions the next time.

    Now for some common sense reform that eliminates scripting. It is crazy to think this is even allowed in an industry that can only grow if everyone has a fair chance, or at least perceives that they do.

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    @iconfantasyJoe said...

    honestly I feel like this is the best thing that could have happened to the industry. It finally opened up a real conversation that many players have been trying to have for years with fantasy sites. I have seen countless threads regarding scripting, multi entry abuse (their term not mine), sharks eating the ecosystem, etc etc and finally it seems as if real change will come of it.

    However, this is all happening in a reactionary fashion, instead of a proactive fashion.
    Had the conversation been opened seriously when these issues were addressed (as it should have), it never would have come to this.

    I hope we can take this is an example for the way we operate in the future in this industry, because no doubt other problems will arise that need fixing. Let’s just try to be a bit more open minded on solutions the next time.

    Now for some common sense reform that eliminates scripting. It is crazy to think this is even allowed in an industry that can only grow if everyone has a fair chance, or at least perceives that they do.

    I agree.

    In regards to scripting, where we ended up is that it should either be outlawed or be provided by the dfs site to everyone free of charge.

    Personally Im against scripting completely, but we are trying to keep the playing field equal and this seemed like the best compromise.

    FCK

  • jrake

    • 152

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #26

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • 2016 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    loolololol

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    Silence is deafening.

    Who stands with the players again?

    FCK

  • bobbyrogers46

    fck,

    I hope this works out man. Player representation outside of the sites and as a group standing on our own is the best thing for this industry. Please everyone take note and ride this wave. It is for the best intrest of us the players.

  • Zialum

    I’m on board. My wishlist:

    - Multi Entry in 50/50s only. Tournaments have a one lineup per player limit.

    - Reasonable limits at each stake level for H2H. My preference is 20 per dollar amount (and see if it needs adjustment from there).

    - Equal information for all players. We’re already taking steps in the right direction by not allowing site employees to play, but I no longer trust them and would prefer a third party looking over their shoulder.

  • pharoah1

    I support this, will look over the draft when I get a chance, and give my input for what it’s worth.

  • Dleepi01

    Where do I sign?

  • tyrvidar

    On the surface this is a great idea, but my question is – who exactly does it represent? How do you overcome the individuality of each player?

    For instance, Zialum thinks multi-entry should be left to 50/50’s. I think that’s the last place multi-entries should be. This is just one small example, neither opinion is right or wrong btw.

    IMO: – Keep the massive multi entry tourneys with the huge payout, but, lower that huge number a bit and flatten the payout structure. Typically around 20% of the players in these tourneys get something back, double that and you’ll see some retention.

    - Significantly increase the number of single entry tourneys.

    - Scripting.
    — Leave it for the massive multi entry tourneys, but, I agree that the sites themselves should be providing this functionality. Why on earth they don’t want to control the programming structure of these scripts I have no idea.
    — No sniping scripts. No scripts for ‘Cash’ games.

    - Regulations are coming but do whatever it takes, above board, to keep as much of the government out of that can possibly done. It may be too late anyhow.

    - Ownership data should be encrypted and protected. In no way should it be ‘live’ or available for access prior to lock unless you want servers to crash and ownership % manipulation to be the next ‘scandal’.

    - Matchup blockers are a must.

    Of course, I have never run a DFS site so I don’t have all the split testing data that they have for what retains players and what doesn’t.

    Just some thoughts from another player.

  • entropy

    This is a Bill of Rights for the One Percent.

    If you wager $500-$2500 you are excluded from the Quarter Arcade. That’s not a big sacrifice.

    As someone who has played 2 MLB season with total wagers of $1200, you do not speak for me!

    I would like to suggest that there be single entry GPPs at the $5 or $10 level open only to players whose average daily volume is less than $25. I also would like to block every one with an average daily volume of more than $25 from taking my H2H, 3-man and other small tournaments I might create.

  • AQUAFTM45

    This is essentially creating a Social Democracy for DFS. This is like saying that The Donald should not be able to purchase a Motel 6. Don’t be a DFS socialist…

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    @entropy said...

    This is a Bill of Rights for the One Percent.

    If you wager $500-$2500 you are excluded from the Quarter Arcade. That’s not a big sacrifice.

    As someone who has played 2 MLB season with total wagers of $1200, you do not speak for me!

    I would like to suggest that there be single entry GPPs at the $5 or $10 level open only to players whose average daily volume is less than $25. I also would like to block every one with an average daily volume of more than $25 from taking my H2H, 3-man and other small tournaments I might create.

    I agree with you 100%, but sure how to do this on broad scale ! as of now there is a portion to promote single entry. I think this is biggest area to help promote long term recreational play.

    No expectation isn’t to size this for everyone, but do our our best to put things back on the right track.

    FCK

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