NBA FORUM

Comments

  • lineupofpeace

    Just got an e-mail about this. Also giving players multiple position eligibility.

  • MickyD10970

    • 349

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #39

      RG Tiered Ranking

    Tonight is a perfect example of why no late swap sucks. The Levine news which did not come out until after lock meant you had to decide before 6 whether or not to play Bjelica.If Levine sits you probably have 0 chance of winning or placing high in a GPP if you don’t roster Bjelica and cash game lineups are also impacted.With Levine playing it is unlikely Bjelica even hits value at 3800. This is far more beneficial to multi – mass lineup guys who would probably have 10-25% of Bjelica just in case. This is also a highly underrated part of the late process where you can leave flexibility with a potential high impact sub (waiting on injury news pre-lock). I like to set my lineups prior to 6 (work during day until 6) and have an hour or 2 to fix the lineup the way I like it after news breaks.

  • Beetlebum

    Nobody has mentioned this yet, but when I received the email From draftKings about no late swap I immediately thought they were doing that to try to get more volume from British players.
    DK is legal now in England and there is a lot of potential for NBA dfs there (unlike other sports such as mlb or nhl), but British player were clearly at a disadvantage due to their time zone (if I lived there and couldn’t stay up until 3 am to check late scratches I wouldn’t play at all).
    DK might be trying to encourage and push bball dfs with this move.

  • coach232

    • Blogger of the Month

    @MikeMineo said...

    I didn’t say to fade him entirely. I said that veteran players on the first night of a b2b and in a neutral at best matchup, on the road, should not be prioritized at more than 5-7% ownership shares, which means if they do indeed get a 0 your night shouldn’t be sabotaged.

    The incentive to remove late swap is to remove the edge from players who simply had a free night from 7PM-10:30PM. As it stands now, I personally find the experience more relaxing and less stressful due to the hard lock, which is what I assume DK was going for.

    I always prefer Fanduel anyway for NBA, so personally not really a big shift.

    A good play getting a surprise scratch and 0 happens like 1-2% of the time.

    not late in the season late scratches happens more frequently. I got burned many times last season because i did not monitor the news

  • Jvanspro

    @MickyD10970 said...

    Tonight is a perfect example of why no late swap sucks. The Levine news which did not come out until after lock meant you had to decide before 6 whether or not to play Bjelica.If Levine sits you probably have 0 chance of winning or placing high in a GPP if you don’t roster Bjelica and cash game lineups are also impacted.With Levine playing it is unlikely Bjelica even hits value at 3800. This is far more beneficial to multi – mass lineup guys who would probably have 10-25% of Bjelica just in case. This is also a highly underrated part of the late process where you can leave flexibility with a potential high impact sub (waiting on injury news pre-lock). I like to set my lineups prior to 6 (work during day until 6) and have an hour or 2 to fix the lineup the way I like it after news breaks.

    You are incorrect here. The LaVine news came before lock.

  • jimfred82

    • Blogger of the Month

    @Jvanspro said...

    You are incorrect here. The LaVine news came before lock.

    This is true. It was two minutes before lock so kind of sucky, but he just had a bruised knee and seemed trending towards playing the whole day. Guys with bruises (especially young guys) rarely miss games for those, unless they’re end of the bench irrelevant type dudes.

    BUT I will agree with you guys on last night being a bit frustrating. LaVine/Bjelica, last second Norman Powell, and even the Butler news could have led people to some value plays…. but then again, a lot of the big plays came from those first two games, so perhaps that wasn’t a bad thing after all. I didn’t see Bjelica’s ownership, or Rondo’s…. did people play those guys? If so, then I think doing our research and having experience probably paid off.

  • Njsum1

    @MickyD10970 said...

    Tonight is a perfect example of why no late swap sucks. The Levine news which did not come out until after lock meant you had to decide before 6 whether or not to play Bjelica.If Levine sits you probably have 0 chance of winning or placing high in a GPP if you don’t roster Bjelica and cash game lineups are also impacted.With Levine playing it is unlikely Bjelica even hits value at 3800. This is far more beneficial to multi – mass lineup guys who would probably have 10-25% of Bjelica just in case. This is also a highly underrated part of the late process where you can leave flexibility with a potential high impact sub (waiting on injury news pre-lock). I like to set my lineups prior to 6 (work during day until 6) and have an hour or 2 to fix the lineup the way I like it after news breaks.

    I understand why some people prefer late swap and why some don’t, and as pointed out by @Jvanspro the news came out before lock, however that has nothing to do with why your argument IMO is extremely flawed. Even if the news came out after lock your argument regarding Bjelica doesn’t really hold water. Here are my reasons why:

    1) Bjelica is a low to mid level NBA talent who has a limited role for a reason, he’s not that good
    2) his last games perfomance was an outlier, might have been the best game of his career, and he was up against the Lakers, who play at the 4th fastest pace in the NBA, the hornets play at the 14th.
    3) so even if he started, the odds of another 40 burger were very slim.
    4) he’s not as good a player as zach Lavine..lavine put up 28dk points in this matchup
    5) so if you gave Bjelica lavines numbers, which he probably wouldn’t have gotten anyway, he’d get 28 points or 7x a 3.8 salary, which is certainly not a must have to win a GPP
    6) last night players were destroying value all over the place, so even on the off chance, Bjelica got 40 again you still wouldn’t have needed him in cash or GPP.
    7) He played 21 minutes last night (against easier competition in the 2nd unit) and only scored 10 DK points. So if by the off chance, he played another 40 he’d likely only get you 20 to 30, and the MME guys who rostered him would not have been at an advantage, quite the opposite in fact.
    8). Just on a personal note, I played 2 lineups in the quarter arcade, I’m small potatoes, and had a 3x and a 2x cash with scores of 305 and 293, with derrick Williams in both lineups only getting me 10 points. Then I played 1 lineup in the two game late slate, I had Jerian Grant at 5% ownership, who went 12x his 3k price and I finished out of the money. Further evidence, that 1 player doesn’t make or break a slate or your chances for profiting.

    So while I understand your preference for late swap, this news, even if it didn’t break til after lock wouldn’t have affected anyone’s ROI in last nights games. If anything it would have hurt more people than it helped, as his ownership would have been sky high for a likely mediocre performance.

  • sjs1890

    • 2013 DraftStreet DSBC Finalist

    Lol the people saying that the announced news of lavine playing coming out 2 minutes before lock is enough time to adjust all lineups is just laughable and ignorant really. The fact is this type of situation is only going to get worse in the heat of the nba season, especially the 2nd half. Also if bjelica started (41 mins last game) he would have been a fantastic play only someone who doesnt really have a clue would say otherwise.

  • Lukan

    Well I play from Uk and this is the reason I can, if I had to wait until 4am to check starters I’d never play.

  • Njsum1

    @sjs1890 said...

    Lol the people saying that the announced news of lavine playing coming out 2 minutes before lock is enough time to adjust all lineups is just laughable and ignorant really. The fact is this type of situation is only going to get worse in the heat of the nba season, especially the 2nd half. Also if bjelica started (41 mins last game) he would have been a fantastic play only someone who doesnt really have a clue would say otherwise.

    Riiiight…cause what happened the game before is an absolute certainty to happen in the next game. Never said he was a bad play, As his price was excellent and as I stated earlier he still should have come in around 5 to 7x his price. Yet for a player of that salary you didn’t need to have him in your lineups even if he was starting. He ended up playing 21 minutes against easier competition in the 2nd unit, and only scored 10 DK points, and Lavine the better player only put up 28dk points. Plus the previous game was against a team that plays at a much faster pace. Are you sure I’m the one (as I can only infer you were referring to me) who needs to get a clue?

  • CNTDFS

    @Jvanspro said...

    You are incorrect here. The LaVine news came before lock.

    No it did not. It came out at 7:04 and they completely changed their reporting on him from the previous updates all day. At 2:03 it was reported he was 50/50 and a GTD (game tipped at 8pm btw which is relevant) at 7:04 after lock I update RW and what do you know, lavine is playing and I quote “his playing status was never really in doubt” well WHAT THE FUCK! how was it never really in doubt when 5 hours ago and even a 6PM it still said he was a GTD and 50/50 to play. I was heated. I called RW out publicly on twitter with time stamps. The lavine playing update absolutely came out at 7:04 PM, some how the time stamp is now 6:58. so he went from a GTD at 6pm to playing at 7:04 huh? no gtd there they werent warming up yet. they had information and withheld it.

    And all you guys saying that bjelica game was an outlier clearly dont do deep enough research. If you researched games in which Bjelica plays 28+ minutes in his career he averages 13+ real points 9+ reb and some peripherials. He averages close to 32 fppg when he plays the minutes he was looking to receive without lavine. Lakers play at a fast pace but again you guys dont do deep enough research they are actually very good defensively this year and bjelica still carved them up. If Lavine sat last nnight Bjelica was going to be the best value on the board, RW manipulated that and then covered their arse when called out. They have no integrity and its not the first time this has happened its just the first time i care enough to say something. Even if they did release the news at 6:58 (they did not it was 7:04 time stamps changed) thats not nearly enough time and for someone who is a GTD for a game that starts in an hour and needs to go through warm ups it baffles me how they had that info at 7 and not say 6:30. The no late swap is terrible for NBA. Its terrible for anyone that actually knows rotations and who comes in for who when a main piece is sitting. Theyve taken your edge away because the average lame could never compete.

  • MickyD10970

    • 349

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #39

      RG Tiered Ranking

    @Njsum1 said...

    I understand why some people prefer late swap and why some don’t, and as pointed out by @Jvanspro the news came out before lock, however that has nothing to do with why your argument IMO is extremely flawed. Even if the news came out after lock your argument regarding Bjelica doesn’t really hold water. Here are my reasons why:

    1) Bjelica is a low to mid level NBA talent who has a limited role for a reason, he’s not that good
    2) his last games perfomance was an outlier, might have been the best game of his career, and he was up against the Lakers, who play at the 4th fastest pace in the NBA, the hornets play at the 14th.
    3) so even if he started, the odds of another 40 burger were very slim.
    4) he’s not as good a player as zach Lavine..lavine put up 28dk points in this matchup
    5) so if you gave Bjelica lavines numbers, which he probably wouldn’t have gotten anyway, he’d get 28 points or 7x a 3.8 salary, which is certainly not a must have to win a GPP
    6) last night players were destroying value all over the place, so even on the off chance, Bjelica got 40 again you still wouldn’t have needed him in cash or GPP.
    7) He played 21 minutes last night (against easier competition in the 2nd unit) and only scored 10 DK points. So if by the off chance, he played another 40 he’d likely only get you 20 to 30, and the MME guys who rostered him would not have been at an advantage, quite the opposite in fact.
    8). Just on a personal note, I played 2 lineups in the quarter arcade, I’m small potatoes, and had a 3x and a 2x cash with scores of 305 and 293, with derrick Williams in both lineups only getting me 10 points. Then I played 1 lineup in the two game late slate, I had Jerian Grant at 5% ownership, who went 12x his 3k price and I finished out of the money. Further evidence, that 1 player doesn’t make or break a slate or your chances for profiting.

    So while I understand your preference for late swap, this news, even if it didn’t break til after lock wouldn’t have affected anyone’s ROI in last nights games. If anything it would have hurt more people than it helped, as his ownership would have been sky high for a likely mediocre performance.

    Could not disagree more. You are using post game scoring to back your argument. Of course after the fact Bjelica was immaterial to winning or losing (although I did have him in 2 lineups – (I was driving when the news broke 2 minutes early) and could not remove him. Had late swap existed I pivot to Powell and the point difference cashes both lineups. I am a T Wolves fan and can clearly tell you if Bjelica gets big minutes he will put up a lot of points, he rebounds well, shoots a lot of 3’s and is fairly active for a big.

    With so many NBA coaches getting cute with their injuries and lineup releases this year will be very dangerous to navigate.

    JMHO

  • Ross
    @CNTDFS said...

    No it did not. It came out at 7:04

    It first came out 3 minutes before lock here: https://twitter.com/APkrawczynski/status/798676284754759684
    We pushed the alert 30 seconds later. Not saying its enough time to adjust lineups, but it was out before lock.

  • bhdevault

    • Lead Moderator

    • Blogger of the Month

    According to the DFS Alerts, https://rotogrinders.com/news, news came out around 6:58. I believe I saw it on twitter around 6:56 or 6:57 and adjusted him into 8 of my 50 lineups.

    Still not much time, I just wish the NBA would make it more of a rule they have to have lineups out at least 1/2 hour before. Still won’t help us for later games though, but, welcome to the NBA, it only gets worse as the season moves forward.

  • MickyD10970

    • 349

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #39

      RG Tiered Ranking

    @CNTDFS said...

    No it did not. It came out at 7:04 and they completely changed their reporting on him from the previous updates all day. At 2:03 it was reported he was 50/50 and a GTD (game tipped at 8pm btw which is relevant) at 7:04 after lock I update RW and what do you know, lavine is playing and I quote “his playing status was never really in doubt” well WHAT THE FUCK! how was it never really in doubt when 5 hours ago and even a 6PM it still said he was a GTD and 50/50 to play. I was heated. I called RW out publicly on twitter with time stamps. The lavine playing update absolutely came out at 7:04 PM, some how the time stamp is now 6:58. so he went from a GTD at 6pm to playing at 7:04 huh? no gtd there they werent warming up yet. they had information and withheld it.

    And all you guys saying that bjelica game was an outlier clearly dont do deep enough research. If you researched games in which Bjelica plays 28+ minutes in his career he averages 13+ real points 9+ reb and some peripherials. He averages close to 32 fppg when he plays the minutes he was looking to receive without lavine. Lakers play at a fast pace but again you guys dont do deep enough research they are actually very good defensively this year and bjelica still carved them up. If Lavine sat last nnight Bjelica was going to be the best value on the board, RW manipulated that and then covered their arse when called out. They have no integrity and its not the first time this has happened its just the first time i care enough to say something. Even if they did release the news at 6:58 (they did not it was 7:04 time stamps changed) thats not nearly enough time and for someone who is a GTD for a game that starts in an hour and needs to go through warm ups it baffles me how they had that info at 7 and not say 6:30. The no late swap is terrible for NBA. Its terrible for anyone that actually knows rotations and who comes in for who when a main piece is sitting. Theyve taken your edge away because the average lame could never compete.

    Missed this before I posted. Interesting as I don’t remember seeing a pre lock time stamp from RW either ( I checked as soon as I got home) The rest of your point on Bjelica is spot on…. If he gets the minutes he is the best value for sure.

  • billholler

    @bhdevault said...

    According to the DFS Alerts, https://rotogrinders.com/news, news came out around 6:58. I believe I saw it on twitter around 6:56 and adjusted him into 8 of my 50 lineups.

    Yep I managed to get him in 3 lineups before lock. I panicked and put him in the G spot (yeah, I said it) and took out D’Angelo Russell. Oops

  • sjs1890

    • 2013 DraftStreet DSBC Finalist

    @Njsum1 said...

    Riiiight…cause what happened the game before is an absolute certainty to happen in the next game. Never said he was a bad play, As his price was excellent and as I stated earlier he still should have come in around 5 to 7x his price. Yet for a player of that salary you didn’t need to have him in your lineups even if he was starting. He ended up playing 21 minutes against easier competition in the 2nd unit, and only scored 10 DK points, and Lavine the better player only put up 28dk points. Plus the previous game was against a team that plays at a much faster pace. Are you sure I’m the one (as I can only infer you were referring to me) who needs to get a clue?

    LOL If lavine was out Bjelica would have gotten over 35 minutes and chances are high he would have got over 30 fantasy points. Do you not understand common sense? Lavines pretty high usage rate would also have to be put on bjelica to score more. The point is bjelica would have been the best play of the night and anyone argueing against that is just laughable.

  • sjs1890

    • 2013 DraftStreet DSBC Finalist

    The news coming at 2 minutes before lock is actually almost worse. It makes everyone panic right before lock not being able to properly construct the teams they wanted. Yeah this really makes everyone enjoy the games more……. NOT.

  • Njsum1

    @MickyD10970 said...

    Could not disagree more. You are using post game scoring to back your argument. Of course after the fact Bjelica was immaterial to winning or losing (although I did have him in 2 lineups – (I was driving when the news broke 2 minutes early) and could not remove him. Had late swap existed I pivot to Powell and the point difference cashes both lineups. I am a T Wolves fan and can clearly tell you if Bjelica gets big minutes he will put up a lot of points, he rebounds well, shoots a lot of 3’s and is fairly active for a big.

    With so many NBA coaches getting cute with their injuries and lineup releases this year will be very dangerous to navigate.

    JMHO

    We could agree to disagree, I see your side, and I never argued that he would have been a bad play, if word came out early enough I would have used him as I feel he’d be a lock for 5x with upside for 7x to 8x in that matchup. Keep in mind the hornets are a MUCH tougher defense than the lakers, and play at a slower pace. So while Bjelica was able to put up 40 DK points in 40 minutes against the plummest matchup in the world, he wouldn’t have done that against the hornets. 30 was a much more likely scenario. So my argument wasn’t that he was a bad play, at that price he’s a nice value, I was arguing that your point that the you would NEED him to compete in GPPs to cash or win was flawed as there were numerous other players last night who crushed 5x value by at least 10 points.

  • Jvanspro

    @CNTDFS said...

    No it did not. It came out at 7:04 and they completely changed their reporting on him from the previous updates all day. At 2:03 it was reported he was 50/50 and a GTD (game tipped at 8pm btw which is relevant) at 7:04 after lock I update RW and what do you know, lavine is playing and I quote “his playing status was never really in doubt” well WHAT THE FUCK! how was it never really in doubt when 5 hours ago and even a 6PM it still said he was a GTD and 50/50 to play. I was heated. I called RW out publicly on twitter with time stamps. The lavine playing update absolutely came out at 7:04 PM, some how the time stamp is now 6:58. so he went from a GTD at 6pm to playing at 7:04 huh? no gtd there they werent warming up yet. they had information and withheld it.

    And all you guys saying that bjelica game was an outlier clearly dont do deep enough research. If you researched games in which Bjelica plays 28+ minutes in his career he averages 13+ real points 9+ reb and some peripherials. He averages close to 32 fppg when he plays the minutes he was looking to receive without lavine. Lakers play at a fast pace but again you guys dont do deep enough research they are actually very good defensively this year and bjelica still carved them up. If Lavine sat last nnight Bjelica was going to be the best value on the board, RW manipulated that and then covered their arse when called out. They have no integrity and its not the first time this has happened its just the first time i care enough to say something. Even if they did release the news at 6:58 (they did not it was 7:04 time stamps changed) thats not nearly enough time and for someone who is a GTD for a game that starts in an hour and needs to go through warm ups it baffles me how they had that info at 7 and not say 6:30. The no late swap is terrible for NBA. Its terrible for anyone that actually knows rotations and who comes in for who when a main piece is sitting. Theyve taken your edge away because the average lame could never compete.

    According to Rotogrinders it came out at 6:58. I saw it last night before lock and had plenty of time for the adjustment. This is more of an NBA problem than late swap. What’s great about not having late swap is everyone has is subject to the unknown. Late swap requires people to sit on Twitter till 10:30 which sucks.

  • sjs1890

    • 2013 DraftStreet DSBC Finalist

    @Jvanspro said...

    Late swap requires people to sit on Twitter till 10:30 which sucks.

    Late swap does not require you to sit on twitter til 10:30 hahaha thats laughable. I do agree late swap does make it really tough for people playing in the UK but still if it causes the product to be substantially worse then my vote is for late swap. Btw most people do just sit around and watch the games anyways so i dont get why its rocket science to check your phones which the majority is on their phones 24/7.

  • tino3692

    Why was the policy of stopping late player swaps instituted?I haven’t heard an explanation save for allowing customers to watch the games instead of monitoring for newsbreaks. But being able to adjust your lineup in light of “relevant sports information” as draftkings terms of use states , is what differentiates Games of Skill and Games of Chance.

    Which begs the question, if Draftkings in general – and it’s NBA contests in particular – are in fact Games of Skill; why is the role of the customer now more reliant on luck – ie. chance – than before? The customer now has to HOPE that a player is not a late scratch or gets injured 20 minutes before the game.

  • billholler

    @tino3692 said...

    Why was the policy of stopping late player swaps instituted?I haven’t heard an explanation save for allowing customers to watch the games instead of monitoring for newsbreaks. But being able to adjust your lineup in light of “relevant sports information” as draftkings terms of use states , is what differentiates Games of Skill and Games of Chance.

    Because DK knows what’s best for you and you are not capable of making adult decisions on your own. You are not capable of drinking beer and hitting the bong and enjoying the NBA product if you have to check for late scratches 2 or 3 times a night. Plus you have a much better chance of winning if you play 10 lineups and set them at noon each day and have a much better chance of beating the sharks that play 750 lineups between their 5 accounts because they will inevitably have a guy that gets scratched in about 100 of those lineups.

  • CNTDFS

    If the argument for no late swap is so people can just watch and enjoy the games. Dont they think when we hear news after lock supposedly while were all just sitting on our couches watching the games that a huge guy is a late scratch maybe well want to change it to make our experience better. DK is just merging with FD and theyre getting rid of late swap every where. Theyre going to say look it worked so well with basketball now this year (2017) for football were doing no late swap and it will slowly trickle to every sport. These DFS companies are up there with Foxwoods for least responsive to what customers actually want.

  • lggarruto

    • 362

      RG Overall Ranking

    FanDuel should change to late swap. Why are they dictating their shitty product on DK

  • billholler

    @CNTDFS said...

    Theyre going to say look it worked so well with basketball now this year (2017) for football were doing no late swap and it will slowly trickle to every sport.

    No late swap for NFL would completely kill the Thur-Mon and Mon-Thur slates while seriously diminishing the Sun-Mon slate. No one at DK or FD is that stupid. Are they?

  • X Unread Thread
  • X Thread with New Replies*
  • *Jumps to your first unread reply

Subforum Index

RotoGrinders.com is the home of the daily fantasy sports community. Our content, rankings, member blogs, promotions and forum discussion all cater to the players that like to create a new fantasy team every day of the week.

If you or someone you know has a gambling problem, crisis counseling and referral services can be accessed by calling 1-800-GAMBLER (1-800-426-2537) (IL). Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (NJ/WV/PA/MI), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (CO), 1-800-BETS OFF (IA), 1-888-532-3500 (VA) or call/text TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN).