NBA FORUM

Comments

  • DraftKings_CM

    • DraftKings Representative

    Hi everyone — NBA Late Swap has been a passionate topic of discussion within the DFS player community over the past few years.

    Because the status of injured and inactive players in the NBA is often unknown until minutes before tip-off, our users have shared a strong desire to swap players out of a lineup(s), so long as the listed start time of player’s game has not passed.

    We also recognize there are pros/cons with enabling late swap versus no late swap feature. On one hand, offering late swap could help a user avoid a “zero” scoring player on their lineup(s). On the other hand, no late swap feature, allows a user to set their lineups without the need for last minute lineup adjustments after breaking news.

    Therefore, throughout each sport season we survey active players about their playing experience and request product feedback. From 2015-2017, NBA user survey results indicated our users were split ~50%/50% when asked if DraftKings should offer late swap.

    During the 2017-2018 we saw a slight shift in sentiment, now strongly in favor of bringing back NBA Late Swap: – The return of NBA Late Swap was the #1 contest enhancement request. – 75% of players surveyed said they would be either “very interested” or “somewhat interested” in the return of Late Swap.

    Given the increase in customer demand for this feature, our main offering for NBA will offer the Late Swap feature on Classic and Tiers game formats for the 2018-2019 season. Late Swap is not necessary for Showdown Captain Mode game formats.

    As the game and community demand evolves, so does DraftKings. The NBA contest managers will be looking at Late Swap utilization and entry trends at the start of the season, and may adjust as the needs and demands of our players evolve.

    Steven & Christie, DraftKings Community Team

  • 2Slik

    • Ranked #16

      RG Tiered Ranking

    The hour plus of research leading up to lock is like being on Wall Street’s trade floor. Now stretch that out several more hours as you sit on pins and needles, waiting to react and scheme strategies to news that may or may not come. A lot of developments happen unnoticed throughout the night and/or within seconds of tipoff and when that happens the “How did Awesemo know Lebron was on a minutes limit, this is BS” or “I couldn’t make the 5 changes in time because I was driving” posts. You’re changing the game from a 1 play hand where RG divulges the majority of the information to a time consuming off the grid realm of micro managing iterations and discrete insider news hunt. Having to react to JaVale McGee tripping over his own shoelace news at 10:25PM where Ivica Zubac may get 5 more minutes of run, and project 1.8 points better than Isaiah Canaan causing a butterfly effect from 15k to $500 in the standings is not my idea of enjoyment.

    Given the situation, No Late Swap had a full season on DK and it’s one of those issues that just has to play itself out. While users zig to DK, zag to FD and hope they get their stuff together.

  • 2Slik

    • Ranked #16

      RG Tiered Ranking

    On a separate note, mtdurham you have taken forum responses on some magical rides. I think you’d be great at writing articles.

  • TheRyanFlaherty

    This one has always been tricky to me, because I certainly can see and feel for the arguments against late swap, but unfortunately the current landscape of the NBA really demands it.
    On a personal level I’ve accepted that if I’m not willing to put that work in than it’s not necessarily for me anymore. Or, I modify and play the smaller slates where I have all the information needed at the time of lock.
    So I’m fine with that, because guessing on dozens of “TBD” scenarios at 7 pm wasn’t something that inspired me to play either.

    Although I will add, I see a lot of dream scenarios that call for only being allowed to switch players ruled out, and if that ever was possible, i’d Jump aboard that being the optimal solution. As the best solutions are rarely in the extremes, and that would seem to be an appropriate compromise and remedy the actual issue at hand.

  • damionismyname

    @2Slik said...

    On a separate note, mtdurham you have taken forum responses on some magical rides. I think you’d be great at writing articles.

  • zpruitt3

    Not looking forward to clicking through every individual h2h from 7:00 – 10:30

  • lpdev

    I personally enjoyed not having late swap for NBA. I set all my lineups at lock on my computer and then head out to spend time with my family. Any late breaking news has to be handled on my cell phone which puts me at a disadvantage. The only reasonable way to make the changes for a large number of lineups on the phone is the global player swap tool which is severely lacking. You can’t even swap for a player with a higher salary if you have lineups with the spare cap space. This forces players that have to make the swap on their phone into a small pool of viable options while some shark is at their PC reoptimizing their lineups entirely. Everybody likes to talk about how bad the NBA is on news, but I played every day last year and rarely felt that I was unsure what would happen based on prior-to-lock reporting. I only got burnt a couple of times on late breaking news. It’s easy to swallow if you know everyone else is in the same boat. Just chalk it up to variance and move on.

    That being said, I see why it’s coming back.There are four groups involved here:
    1) Those that want late swap and will benefit by taking full advantage. This is a small group that will make out well for their time and effort throughout the season. They will react quickly to any late breaking news and reoptimize their lineups entirely.

    2) Those that want late swap but don’t realize that it’s bad for them. This is the largest group and probably the reason that late swap is returning. Ignorance is bliss right? They will get to sub-optimally swap out a 0 for the same 2 players that everyone else in this group swapped to once or twice a season. They are at a disadvantage on these nights and even a larger disadvantage on all other nights when news breaks on players not in their lineups.

    3) Those that don’t want late swap and realize it’s bad for them. This is a small group that includes myself.

    4) Those that want late swap and realize it’s bad for them. Idiots!

  • lineupofpeace

    This news is:

    1. Great for pros and serious grinders who will use this to gain an even bigger edge over everyone else
    2. Terrible for regular grinders who play NBA seriously but don’t have the time/resources to utilize late swap to its full extent
    3. Good for casual players who will lose anyway but can at least avoid the frustration of taking zeros in their lineup on certain nights

  • Jvanspro

    @lpdev said...

    I personally enjoyed not having late swap for NBA. I set all my lineup at lock on my computer and then head out to spend time with my family. Any late breaking news has to be handled on my cell phone which puts me at a disadvantage. The only reasonable way to make the changes for a large number of lineups on the phone is the global player swap tool which is severely lacking. You can’t even swap for a player with a higher salary if you have lineups with the spare cap space. This forces players that have to make the swap on their phone into a small pool of viable options while some shark is at their PC reoptimizing their lineups entirely. Everybody likes to talk about how bad the NBA is on news, but I played every day last year and rarely felt that I was unsure what would happen based on prior-to-lock reporting. I only got burnt a couple of times on late breaking news. It’s easy to swallow if you know everyone else is in the same boat. Just chalk it up to variance and move on.

    That being said, I see why it’s coming back.There are four groups involved here:
    1) Those that want late swap and will benefit by taking full advantage. This is a small group that will make out well for their time and effort throughout the season. They will react quickly to any late breaking news and reoptimize their lineups entirely.

    2) Those that want late swap but don’t realize that it’s bad for them. The is the largest group and probably the reason that late swap is returning. Ignorance is bliss right? They will get to sub-optimally swap out a 0 for the same 2 players that everyone else in this group swapped to once or twice a season. They are at a disadvantage on these nights and even a larger disadvantage on all other nights when news breaks on players not in their lineups.

    3) Those that don’t want late swap and realize it’s bad for them. This is a small group that includes myself.

    4) Those that want late swap and realize it’s bad for them. Idiots!

    This is the best post so far on the threat. You sum up everything perfectly.

    Let’s all rejoice that we, along with 20% of the field don’t have to take a 0, meanwhile everyone is now swapping to the new chalk play. Well that is except group 1, who truly understand late swap and now are flying up the leaderboards. Meanwhile group 2 and 4 don’t understand why they can win at NBA DFS and quit and look forward to MLB before Christmas.

  • Trappist1

    @lpdev said...

    I personally enjoyed not having late swap for NBA. I set all my lineups at lock on my computer and then head out to spend time with my family. Any late breaking news has to be handled on my cell phone which puts me at a disadvantage. The only reasonable way to make the changes for a large number of lineups on the phone is the global player swap tool which is severely lacking. You can’t even swap for a player with a higher salary if you have lineups with the spare cap space. This forces players that have to make the swap on their phone into a small pool of viable options while some shark is at their PC reoptimizing their lineups entirely. Everybody likes to talk about how bad the NBA is on news, but I played every day last year and rarely felt that I was unsure what would happen based on prior-to-lock reporting. I only got burnt a couple of times on late breaking news. It’s easy to swallow if you know everyone else is in the same boat. Just chalk it up to variance and move on.

    That being said, I see why it’s coming back.There are four groups involved here:
    1) Those that want late swap and will benefit by taking full advantage. This is a small group that will make out well for their time and effort throughout the season. They will react quickly to any late breaking news and reoptimize their lineups entirely.

    2) Those that want late swap but don’t realize that it’s bad for them. This is the largest group and probably the reason that late swap is returning. Ignorance is bliss right? They will get to sub-optimally swap out a 0 for the same 2 players that everyone else in this group swapped to once or twice a season. They are at a disadvantage on these nights and even a larger disadvantage on all other nights when news breaks on players not in their lineups.

    3) Those that don’t want late swap and realize it’s bad for them. This is a small group that includes myself.

    4) Those that want late swap and realize it’s bad for them. Idiots!

    Maybe people are not as idiots as you assume, some might have decided NBA is best avoided late swap or not. NBA is beyond a joke when it comes to team news reporting from the start of the season and gradually gets worse to absurd levels after the all-star break when teams decided to deliberately do tanking. I have the notes with me to prove it from last season. Till NBA as league acts professionally and have enforced team new reporting, the wise action will be to leave NBA DFS alone. It is not like there is a shortage of sports to play in the lobbies.

  • Trappist1

    @Jvanspro said...

    This is the best post so far on the threat. You sum up everything perfectly.

    Let’s all rejoice that we, along with 20% of the field don’t have to take a 0, meanwhile everyone is now swapping to the new chalk play. Well that is except group 1, who truly understand late swap and now are flying up the leaderboards. Meanwhile group 2 and 4 don’t understand why they can win at NBA DFS and quit and look forward to MLB before Christmas.

    I think you are grossly overlooking the fact that most do understand the strategies involved in late swap. Late-swap is used for straight swap, for blocking and hedging after seeing earlier results and also for re-optimizing whole line-up if there is a need to do that. Of course, most might not have the advanced computer skills to re-optimize line-up’s very efficiently but that is a different matter. To think people just see and use late swap for just straight swaps is very simplistic conclusion.

  • Jvanspro

    @Trappist1 said...

    I think you are grossly overlooking the fact that most do understand the strategies involved in late swap. Late-swap is used for straight swap, for blocking and hedging after seeing earlier results and also for re-optimizing whole line-up if there is a need to do that. Of course, most might not have the advanced computer skills to re-optimize line-up’s very efficiently but that is a different matter. To think people just see and use late swap for just straight swaps is very simplistic conclusion.

    Maybe, but 95% of people do not use it that way. Most are not by a computer all night and are doing it via a mobile device. Which still puts them in group 2 or 4.

  • Rasmus

    The european market is probably too small to even take it into consideration, but the changes won’t help to make it growth though. NBA starts at 11pm or later, so i had to stay up the whole night which is not possible.

  • DraftKings_CM

    • DraftKings Representative

    @yisman said...

    Here was the exact verbiage.

    “Draftkings players with $1 Million in lifetime entry fees will not be able to play in contests that have an entry fee less than $5 AND a total prize pool less than $25,000.”

    You forgot to mention that the highest volume players are restricted from playing in sub $3 contests. We pasted a direct quote for your convenience below.

    All low entry fee contests are available to everyone except the highest-volume DraftKings players. The highest-volume players are ineligible to enter contests if the entry fee is less than $3. They are also ineligible to enter contests when the entry fee is less than $5 if the prize pool is less than $25,000 guaranteed.

    https://www.draftkings.com/lp/player-first

    - DraftKings Community Team

  • NIN1002

    Yahoo has always used late swap, so it seemed the other sites would figure it out sooner or later. Of course, why try the rest when you can try the BEST???

  • Jvanspro

    @DraftKings_CM said...

    You forgot to mention that the highest volume players are restricted from playing in sub $3 contests. We pasted a direct quote for your convenience below.

    All low entry fee contests are available to everyone except the highest-volume DraftKings players. The highest-volume players are ineligible to enter contests if the entry fee is less than $3. They are also ineligible to enter contests when the entry fee is less than $5 if the prize pool is less than $25,000 guaranteed.

    https://www.draftkings.com/lp/player-first

    - DraftKings Community Team

    This is vague can you please clarify what your definition of a high volume player not eligible to play in these contest is? Thanks

  • mtdurham

    @damionismyname said...

    Maybe you should watch the video again before you go making assumptions and fabricating false statements because nowhere in the video does he say he prefers lateswap. He actually says in the first 30 seconds he has no agenda or preference. You keep complaining about it yet you say you are a casual player. Play on fd or play turbo and late slates and stop complaining.

    Maybe you should try watching the video again. 3rd time’s a charm.

  • mtdurham

    @2Slik said...

    On a separate note, mtdurham you have taken forum responses on some magical rides. I think you’d be great at writing articles.

    Thank you, Just doing God’s work my friend

  • Trappist1

    @Jvanspro said...

    This is vague can you please clarify what your definition of a high volume player not eligible to play in these contest is? Thanks

    It is defined as high volume players that have a combined buy-in fee that has passed the $1 million mark. Think there is around 400 of these high volume players if i remember it correctly when this rule was announced.

  • mtdurham

    Also at 4 AM last night i got mixed up between Michelle Pfeiffer who played Catwoman in Batman Returns and Kim Basinger who played Vicki Vale….

    Who is that?!

    Vicki Vale

    Great song. The Batdance.

  • damionismyname

    @mtdurham said...

    Maybe you should try watching the video again. 3rd time’s a charm.

    Time: 0.20

    “so without any agenda or preference I’m just hoping to educate people on a couple things and raise the level of debate.”

    Words from your God Fast Eddie Fear.

    I’m done with this back and forth. Good luck and hope you hit one this year.

  • yisman

    @zpruitt3 said...

    Not looking forward to clicking through every individual h2h from 7:00 – 10:30

    What?

  • KindGuy

    @yisman said...

    What?

    With late swap, a strategy that many sharp people use is checking their heads to heads to see where they stand and act accordingly. Using tools like the RG extension, users can see how much salary cap the players yet to tip off take up. Then, using this info, they can employ a strategy called “blocking” where, if possible, they will play those players with the aim of preventing their opponent from making up any ground.

  • mtdurham

    @damionismyname said...

    Time: 0.20

    “so without any agenda or preference I’m just hoping to educate people on a couple things and raise the level of debate.”

    Words from your God Fast Eddie Fear.

    I’m done with this back and forth. Good luck and hope you hit one this year.

    So you made it 20 seconds into the video. Heck of an attention span man. Typical millenial. Take your adderall and Maybe listen to the part where he says he prefers late swap then get back to me.

    The fact that you have D. Rose as your avatar says it all…. Typical hero of the “ style over substance” generation

  • mtdurham

    @elementasrat said...

    With late swap, a strategy that many sharp people use is checking their heads to heads to see where they stand and act accordingly. Using tools like the RG extension, users can see how much salary cap the players yet to tip off take up. Then, using this info, they can employ a strategy called “blocking” where, if possible, they will play those players with the aim of preventing their opponent from making up any ground.

    Also works the other way…. say I’m waaaay ahead…they know they gotta play a SG and hope he hits eight 3 pointers….. if he’s way ahead they just put in a 26 minute power forward that grabs 8 rebounds in his sleep.

    Late swap is going to ruin NBA prize pools….fast

  • ttucowboy84

    damionismyname either has no clue or just doesn’t care in the name of making money. mtdurham is my spirit animal. Good work sir.

  • X Unread Thread
  • X Thread with New Replies*
  • *Jumps to your first unread reply

Subforum Index

RotoGrinders.com is the home of the daily fantasy sports community. Our content, rankings, member blogs, promotions and forum discussion all cater to the players that like to create a new fantasy team every day of the week.

If you or someone you know has a gambling problem, crisis counseling and referral services can be accessed by calling 1-800-GAMBLER (1-800-426-2537) (IL). Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (NJ/WV/PA/MI), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (CO), 1-800-BETS OFF (IA), 1-888-532-3500 (VA) or call/text TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN).