NFL FORUM

Comments

  • colinwdrew

    • 399

      RG Overall Ranking

    • 2020 DraftKings FHWC Champion

    • 2021 DraftKings FHWC Finalist

    So DK tweeted out millionaire maker ownership here http://playbook.draftkings.com/nfl/millionaire-maker-percent-owned-week-3/ which as of 230pm still includes ownership data for games that have not yet started. IMO this is a big leak and should never happen. It also seems like something that your average analyst should probably not have access too, and able to tell his buddies who is owned and who the best players have. Hey did you know that CSURAM has Randall Cobb going late? Given that they can access the macro results it seems probable they can access specific users during and/or before contests start.

    They definitely should no be sharing it publicly, if they’re going to do it just list the full rosters in the contest and call it a day.

    • Link
    • Last Updated 4 years ago
  • eisenhauert10

    Do not, I repeat do not read these comments. Or do and laugh at the 52 – 65 y.o housewives who read too many newspapers.

    http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/10/06/446300386/fantasy-sports-sites-face-questions-about-games-integrity

  • jmac1204

    @Ryazan said...

    people kept clamoring for “pros” to defend this, so HERE I AM, DEFENDING IT.

    Defending while yelling at people the whole way is perhaps not the best way for pros to attack this. The problem with your defense of the entire situation is that you have an agenda. Of course you want all of this to go away and for people to not look outside the box and see the possibilities of corruption that may be going on. You are a pro and have made lots of money doing this, so of course you wouldn’t want to see the industry in jeopardy. Now please know that I am not saying this is a bad thing…I completely understand where you are coming from. But the fact is that people feel cheated, and you yelling at people saying that they don’t have proof does not help that feeling. This an internet forum and not a court of law, therefore I believe people are allowed to speculate.

    Here’s the thing…no one will get any proof because there is no regulation on the industry. Everyone is just supposed to believe what the entities with the most to lose (DK and FD) have to say on the matter. Forgive me for looking objectively, but I can only take what these companies’ PR departments say with a grain of salt. Until some sort of gaming commission is established for daily fantasy sports, its users will always be at risk of some sort of corruption.

    Personally, I tend to side with the line of thinking of “Where there’s smoke, there is fire”. This looks very bad to me and absolutely smells of corruption.

  • JimmyTango

    @Ryazan said...

    can the logical people please realize that quite literally, NOTHING bad has happened. No one was doing insider trading.

    Really? How do you know?

    Oh right, you don’t.

  • Ryazan

    • x3

      2015 FanDuel WFFC Finalist

    • x2

      2015 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    @MikeMineo said...

    it’s not too useful in NFL (especially since we have the whole week to decide and Thurs FD contests provide indication of ownership for week), but certainly for MLB when you have a “Player A vs. Player B” dilemma and you’re playing in a GPP and you generally project A and B similarly. you don’t see the advantage of having ownership data in a game like MLB where everyone’s ceiling and floor is theoretically identical, and you’re between choosing a handful of players? a good GPP player is going with the lower owned player every time, or at least what they PROJECT to be the lowest owned player.

    when you take the element of projecting out of ownership, there’s an inside edge. the pre-lock ownership data either needs to be available to 100% of users or 0%.

    no no no!

    I would rather have Trout at 40% owned hitting 2 HRs than having McCutchen go 0 for 4 at the same price at a 5% owned vs Arrieta.

    Nothing is predictable in MLB, so having that 5% owned guy will screw you just as often as it will help you – it is not a real advantage. (again, I believe Dk when they say that they do not release % owned info until slates lock)

  • eddiemunstor

    @ Ryazan…..still waiting for your reason why BOTH sites obscure ownership if it doesn’t matter. ANSWER THAT.

    We understand you pros have a lot to lose if this goes away or gets regulated. Maybe you should mimic the other pros and just stay mum.

  • realdeals

    Ryan, in all honesty you aren’t the right “pro” to argue this. You just make it much worse.

  • y2mulder

    If this story makes Around the Horn and PTI, we are getting to 1000 pages.

  • Stewburtx8

    • 2012 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    @srolleDFS said...

    Evidence ethan didnt cheat.

    here’s a tournament ethan won. its the “proof” he cheated, according to some.

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/12768/contests/12768-14080975/entries/202921697/scoring?entry=202830364 (ht @rotokevin)

    start at the bottom, and go thru his lineups, losers first. he had some really terrible lineups in this puppy. some people think ethan cheated by looking at the players that sharps played dk. he then used that info on fanduel to win tournaments in august like this one.

    but he didnt play a core group of players the sharps on dk we’re playing… or whatever people think he did. he just played everyone.

    worst performing 5 lineups

    NYM 4 stack.
    COL 4 stack
    SEA 4 stack
    LOS 4 stack
    SDP 4 stack

    thats only the lineups that finished 4409th/5747th and lower in the gpp he also got first in. he also played 4 different pitchers in those 5 lineups.

    does that sound like a cheater with hot picks? it looks like a guy playing literally nearly every batter and pitching taking the field that night.

    I’m glad someone finally looked at this. As I said earlier, playing a variety of different stacks with little overlap can be a very viable top heavy GPP strategy in baseball. You can have little overlap and end up with 1-3 lineups cashing out of 20+. The strategy is try to get 1 lineup to finish high enough to profit. His results make sense to me if he is using this strategy playing A LOT of lineups.

  • Agent47

    Ryazan, I’m not sure if you’re just trolling at this point or if you’re really that oblivious to why some people would have issue with some of the apparent data integrity and access issues that are at the heart of this matter…

    At this point, it’s hard for me to take seriously anyone who reduces this whole thread to “losing players” looking for an excuse to blame for them not winning. Players who are ranked much higher and have been more successful than me have spoken up and articulated what the concerns are. It’s amazing that some people just want to keep sticking their head in the sand and pretend that everything is fine and this isn’t a big deal. I’m not saying DFS is going away but that I think some procedural changes may be on the horizon, whether willingly on the part of the Big 2 or unwillingly.

  • bostonstrong1017

    it’s important we wait until we have all the facts before we jump to conclusions. this is going to take some time, but im sure eventually this will be better for the players

  • MikeMineo

    @Ryazan said...

    I would rather have Trout at 40% owned hitting 2 HRs than having McCutchen go 0 for 4 at the same price at a 5% owned vs Arrieta.

    if you think Trout is going to hit 2 HR’s and McCutchen is going 0-4 then you clearly don’t value them similarly, which misses my point.

    I think you’re wrong. I believe that having a 5% owned guy compared to a 20% owned guy is advantageous in MLB DFS when both players theoretically have the same odds of reaching value. your response implies that you wouldn’t peg McCutchen and Trout as hitting similar value despite similar price, so it’s not a situation that ownership would help. but there are many others where it would.

  • ckamins87

    • 2016 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2016 FanDuel WFBBC Finalist

    @srolleDFS said...

    Evidence ethan didnt cheat.

    here’s a tournament ethan won. its the “proof” he cheated, according to some.

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/12768/contests/12768-14080975/entries/202921697/scoring?entry=202830364 (ht @rotokevin)

    start at the bottom, and go thru his lineups, losers first. he had some really terrible lineups in this puppy. some people think ethan cheated by looking at the players that sharps played dk. he then used that info on fanduel to win tournaments in august like this one.

    but he didnt play a core group of players the sharps on dk we’re playing… or whatever people think he did. he just played everyone.

    worst performing 5 lineups

    NYM 4 stack.
    COL 4 stack
    SEA 4 stack
    LOS 4 stack
    SDP 4 stack

    thats only the lineups that finished 4409th/5747th and lower in the gpp he also got first in. he also played 4 different pitchers in those 5 lineups.

    does that sound like a cheater with hot picks? it looks like a guy playing literally nearly every batter and pitching taking the field that night.

    I appreciate the time you took to look this up, and I hope some doubters suddenly find their common sense.

    5720/5749, and also got 1st. I only looked at 4 pages total and saw 2 entries. Who knows how many were between. But only that one in 1st shows in the table they worship as truth, and somehow they define it as a statistical improbability and evidence of “cheating”. His lineup that won had one 1% owned player, and the rest were normal. Time to remove the tinfoil hats please

  • budfox6

    If Harry Reid is commenting on this, then regulation and reform is coming.

  • Ryazan

    • x3

      2015 FanDuel WFFC Finalist

    • x2

      2015 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    @reztes757 said...

    If they can view ownership on games that haven’t started mid slate can’t we assume they can view ownership before a slate starts?

    seeing ownership % of the players in later games on DK, that does not give anyone an edge who works for DK since they all play elsewhere. It is NOT insider info. If I see that Trout has a 10pm game and he is only 4% owned cuz he is facing Felix Hernandez, there is no inside edge of wanting to use him specifically because he is low owned if i believe he will go 0 for 4 against an ace pitcher. A DK employee could play on another DFS site other than Fanduel, and he will know that trout is 5% owned on DK………and? so? that helps you win money how?? You can’t predict touchdowns and HR’s, so an ownership % of a player does not just tell you “ok this guy is low owned and he’s going off, USE HIM!!!!”

  • bitdigger2013

    @Ryazan said...

    I am saying it’s not cheating in the first place, because a) DK has confirmed that the data was revealed to Ethan after 1pm, and b) EVEN KNOWING the data wont help anyone win any more than they could already win

    a) DK confirming something does not make it fact

    b) Just because you would not know what to do with the “DATA” doesn’t mean it doesn’t give someone who does an advantage

  • pmsimkins

    • 2014 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    • 2015 FanDuel WFBBC Finalist

    @realdeals said...

    I’ve said this a few times in this thread, I’ll say it one last time. s change from Thurs to Sun. What was Black Unicorns % on Thursday compare to Sunday after Cutler was announced as the starter. I actually expected his % to be in around 25 and not the 14.5. I’m sure you and Ryan had him at 15%.

    And lastly, this isn’t just about football.

    Do you really think that those changes aren’t predictable? Even if a person had zero knowledge or common sense the talking heads on TV are pointing those situations out every 5 minutes.

    There are a lot of issues in this industry, contest size, pay structure, ridiculous advertising and rake to name a few. It’d be so much more worthwhile if all this energy was invested there instead of tin foil hat BS.

  • chaseharrell

    @Stewburtx8 said...

    I’m glad someone finally looked at this. As I said earlier, playing a variety of different stacks with little overlap can be a very viable top heavy GPP strategy in baseball. You can have little overlap and end up with 1-3 lineups cashing out of 20+. The strategy is try to get 1 lineup to finish high enough to profit. His results make sense to me if he is using this strategy playing A LOT of lineups.

    Ever heard of covering up? It would be extremely obvious if all of his lineups did well. So why wouldn’t he just do a few crap lineups knowing he was a huge advantage with his “good lineups” to make up for them?

  • bhdevault

    • Lead Moderator

    • Blogger of the Month

    @srolleDFS said...

    Evidence ethan didnt cheat.

    here’s a tournament ethan won. its the “proof” he cheated, according to some.

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/12768/contests/12768-14080975/entries/202921697/scoring?entry=202830364 (ht @rotokevin)

    start at the bottom, and go thru his lineups, losers first. he had some really terrible lineups in this puppy. some people think ethan cheated by looking at the players that sharps played dk. he then used that info on fanduel to win tournaments in august like this one.

    but he didnt play a core group of players the sharps on dk we’re playing… or whatever people think he did. he just played everyone.

    worst performing 5 lineups

    NYM 4 stack.
    COL 4 stack
    SEA 4 stack
    LOS 4 stack
    SDP 4 stack

    thats only the lineups that finished 4409th/5747th and lower in the gpp he also got first in. he also played 4 different pitchers in those 5 lineups.

    does that sound like a cheater with hot picks? it looks like a guy playing literally nearly every batter and pitching taking the field that night.

    Awesome find.

  • fish43

    THE GUY ON SIRIUS XM IS LITERALLY SAYING RIGHT NOW ON HIS SHOW THAT KNOWING THE OWNERSHIP % WOULD HELP!! this is an “expert” saying this. it doesn’t correlate to the player producing how he is supposed to but ANYONE who plays DFS knows that knowing the % of players will absolutely help you win…..

  • troveur

    TBH anyone involved in THIS particular incident should be fired immediately. Just consider all the PR damage and monetary damage done to both DK and the industry that will come from this in addition to the weak minded people in this thread that are running to the cashout window.

    This event is being treated as a scandal both inside the DFS bubble and much more so outside the bubble with hugely negative eye catching headlines and news stories. Heads should roll like they would in any other colossal fuck up costing a company huge amounts of money.

  • Chad32676

    Gronk just got fired too.He had to give his tshirt back.

  • fish43

    everyone involved is breaking their backs bending over backwords to defend this ethan guy. but i agree with troveur…FIRE HIS ASS and ban him from playing! if this kind of mistake was made in any other major company and caused even 1/3 of the PR damage his “mistake” caused, their ass would be fired!!!

  • eddiemunstor

    @Chad32676 said...

    Gronk just got fired too.He had to give his tshirt back.

    Gronk like knowing player percentages

  • Ryazan

    • x3

      2015 FanDuel WFFC Finalist

    • x2

      2015 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    @eddiemunstor said...

    @ Ryazan…..still waiting for your reason why BOTH sites obscure ownership if it doesn’t matter. ANSWER THAT.

    We understand you pros have a lot to lose if this goes away or gets regulated. Maybe you should mimic the other pros and just stay mum.

    I was seeing ownership on Fanduel as recently as last year in NFL (for Thurs slates), so i really don’t know why they hide it these days – maybe they dont want a casual player completely copying a pros lineup. Seems like a policy they have in place to ensure no copying of lineups happens. But it is all accusations with no proof that Ethan or anyone else have been copying lineups and winning money. I would never wanna copy anyones lineup, because i TRUST MYSELF more than i trust anyone else when it comes to decisions of players.

    People need to start playing better, maybe they will be whining less about those who do win.

    I have nothing to lose here, ive already won, FAIR AND SQUARE. I don’t have to mimic any of the pros, it’s a free country and I will speak out to silence those that have no idea what they are talking about.

  • tommygmets86

    @srolleDFS said...

    Evidence ethan didnt cheat.

    here’s a tournament ethan won. its the “proof” he cheated, according to some.

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/12768/contests/12768-14080975/entries/202921697/scoring?entry=202830364 (ht @rotokevin)

    start at the bottom, and go thru his lineups, losers first. he had some really terrible lineups in this puppy. some people think ethan cheated by looking at the players that sharps played dk. he then used that info on fanduel to win tournaments in august like this one.

    but he didnt play a core group of players the sharps on dk we’re playing… or whatever people think he did. he just played everyone.

    worst performing 5 lineups

    NYM 4 stack.
    COL 4 stack
    SEA 4 stack
    LOS 4 stack
    SDP 4 stack

    thats only the lineups that finished 4409th/5747th and lower in the gpp he also got first in. he also played 4 different pitchers in those 5 lineups.

    does that sound like a cheater with hot picks? it looks like a guy playing literally nearly every batter and pitching taking the field that night.

    Good find. I’m really hoping this ends well, so that makes me a bit more confident.

  • X Unread Thread
  • X Thread with New Replies*
  • *Jumps to your first unread reply

Subforum Index

RotoGrinders.com is the home of the daily fantasy sports community. Our content, rankings, member blogs, promotions and forum discussion all cater to the players that like to create a new fantasy team every day of the week.

If you or someone you know has a gambling problem, crisis counseling and referral services can be accessed by calling 1-800-GAMBLER (1-800-426-2537) (IL). Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (NJ/WV/PA/MI), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (CO), 1-800-BETS OFF (IA), 1-888-532-3500 (VA) or call/text TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN).