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  • colinwdrew

    • 301

      RG Overall Ranking

    • 2020 DraftKings FHWC Champion

    • 2021 DraftKings FHWC Finalist

    So DK tweeted out millionaire maker ownership here http://playbook.draftkings.com/nfl/millionaire-maker-percent-owned-week-3/ which as of 230pm still includes ownership data for games that have not yet started. IMO this is a big leak and should never happen. It also seems like something that your average analyst should probably not have access too, and able to tell his buddies who is owned and who the best players have. Hey did you know that CSURAM has Randall Cobb going late? Given that they can access the macro results it seems probable they can access specific users during and/or before contests start.

    They definitely should no be sharing it publicly, if they’re going to do it just list the full rosters in the contest and call it a day.

    • Link
    • Last Updated 3 years ago
  • COMMISH

    @Zialum said...

    I think it’s interesting, but I’m worried guys would use a scraper and then create optimized lineups from that. While that’s better than what’s currently happening, I don’t think it’s the best solution. It would be fair for all involved, but only the highly skilled would be able to do it.

    The game isn’t healthy if the most skilled players win every time. I think we should be aiming for our most skilled players to have an ROI of like 10-15 %. I think that would mess up the ecosystem in a way that the best players would be winning with an ROI of 30+. That’s pure speculation, but it’s why I’m opposed to it.

    Indirectly, I think you are on to something. Not any time soon, but I could see the day where the crazy do-gooding regulators hatch a “spread the wealth” scheme where caps are placed on tournaments. For example, top $1 million prize would become a $500,000 prize, with the other $500,000 being spread amongst the rest of the participants.

  • Whynot138

    First off, I totally apologize as I’m sure this has been covered in detail in the previous 155 pages and covered by Robbins and crew

    but what I don’t see and scares the hell out of me is lack of recognition that FD, DK and all others are in the data integrity business. They have to ensure that everything they do protects the data of the game against all internal and external threats. They will be (and im sure have been) attacked by many with the attempt to get information that will provide advantages. Disallowing their employees to play on other sites is so obvious but clearly not anywhere near what needs to be done. As big as these companies are now they need protective measures similar to the stock market, paramutual betting, etc

    admittedly I’m behind in this whole saga but is this the kind of issue that’s being addressed or is it more about our employees cant play elsewhere and we’ll have someone look at our processes. I guess those are starts but wow

  • rainbowtroutman

    I think the days of $million top prizes will come to an end

  • winsome

    I had to laugh when Ley said he received info from a “big time player” that all of the “pros” were noticeably absent from the “boards”. Robins’ response was to say it was due to it being a slow night for sports as if Ley asked him about action at the site.

  • dgriff

    For those looking for more information I would be shocked if we get it any time soon. If there is one thing I have learned in business it is that sometimes the less information you give the better as long as your message is what the majority of people want to hear. I think what has been said satisfies the average DFS user. Most people just want to get upset for a day and then hear what is being done and move on even if what is said is somewhat lip service. We are such a sound bite society now most don’t want to know the details and a headline puts it to rest in their minds.

    With that said I’m sure details will come out but not for a while so that what is said is heavily scrubbed and scrutinized by their PR depts and Attorneys. To give details right now just allows more questions to be asked which doesn’t help their immediate mission which is to calm the general media down enough to where it isn’t a huge story anymore.

  • WhiskeyTavon4

    • 578

      RG Overall Ranking

    • x2

      2014 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2017 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    This was posted two years ago in the forum. During that time in several message board posts myself and others stated that no employee of one site should be allowed to play at any other sites because of the clear conflict of interest and potential overall damage it could due to the industry. This post was the fanduel rep’s response.

    Regarding Kaetorade’s post, we’ve always been open about the fact that some of our employees at FanDuel have access to lineups. I assume that the same is true at most other sites. We could potentially limit the ability of support staff to see lineups, although it would also limit their ability to troubleshoot issues that players reported. But I have a very hard time envisioning a setup where our programmers and ops staff wouldn’t have the ability to see lineups in the database.

    Our belief is that this wouldn’t afford much of an advantage, because the pricing structures on each site are wildly different (and rosters, positions, and scoring vary as well). Regardless of that, our employees also understand that they are expected not to use this information and in fact shouldn’t be viewing this data except as needed to do their jobs.

    “We also believe that it is important for employees of sites to play on other sites. Without that happening, the industry as a whole will suffer, as everything from software to player pricing to contest types is generally going to be a lot better designed if people who play DFS are involved in the process…not to mention the additional difficulty that sites will have hiring quality employees if people know that they’ll have to quit playing DFS to work for a site.”

  • einars

    @winsome said...

    I had to laugh when Ley said he received info from a “big time player” that all of the “pros” were noticeably absent from the “boards”. Robins’ response was to say it was due to it being a slow night for sports as if Ley asked him about action at the site.

    why would robbins assume he was talking about a 3rd party forum? also that’s a ridiculous question regardless

  • Zialum

    @COMMISH said...

    Indirectly, I think you are on to something. Not any time soon, but I could see the day where the crazy do-gooding regulators hatch a “spread the wealth” scheme where caps are placed on tournaments. For example, top $1 million prize would become a $500,000 prize, with the other $500,000 being spread amongst the rest of the participants.

    I don’t know if it’s a scheme, but I think tournaments are too top heavy right now. They offer a million bucks because that’s a great marketing tool, but i think the game would be better served if more people could play it profitably. To me, either no multi entries and a huge top prize (which can’t be done yet because they need the entry fees of the multi entries), or multi entries with a less top heavy structure. The fish need a chance to make money or they won’t play.

  • MrSnuffleupagus

    Yea 15 years of dealing poker and playing, I haven’t learned when people are uncomfortable or lying.

  • KeithR70

    7

  • winsome

    @Zialum said...

    he fish need a chance to make money or they won’t play.

    Every casino in the world begs to differ.

  • rainbowtroutman

    @WhiskeyTavon4 said...

    This was posted two years ago in the forum. During that time in several message board posts myself and others stated that no employee of one site should be allowed to play at any other sites because of the clear conflict of interest and potential overall damage it could due to the industry. This post was the fanduel rep’s response.

    Regarding Kaetorade’s post, we’ve always been open about the fact that some of our employees at FanDuel have access to lineups. I assume that the same is true at most other sites. We could potentially limit the ability of support staff to see lineups, although it would also limit their ability to troubleshoot issues that players reported. But I have a very hard time envisioning a setup where our programmers and ops staff wouldn’t have the ability to see lineups in the database.

    Our belief is that this wouldn’t afford much of an advantage, because the pricing structures on each site are wildly different (and rosters, positions, and scoring vary as well). Regardless of that, our employees also understand that they are expected not to use this information and in fact shouldn’t be viewing this data except as needed to do their jobs.

    “We also believe that it is important for employees of sites to play on other sites. Without that happening, the industry as a whole will suffer, as everything from software to player pricing to contest types is generally going to be a lot better designed if people who play DFS are involved in the process…not to mention the additional difficulty that sites will have hiring quality employees if people know that they’ll have to quit playing DFS to work for a site.”

    My how 1 tweet changed that thinking

  • thurman3422

    Hopefully everything will turn out OK and necessary safeguards are put in place.

  • Zialum

    @winsome said...

    Every casino in the world begs to differ.

    I disagree. They make money by winning 52% of the time and then putting in volume to get rid of variance. If casinos win 80% of the time, only the most degenerate players would stick around.

  • budfox6

    @Ryazan said...

    alright good for him for saying what will make the masses happy. To me, there is certainly no edge in knowing owner %s and I do not need this info to win.

    Amen

  • rainbowtroutman

    I am a entertainment player with small stakes. Pure entertainment. I just went to sign up for fantasy feud and was going to enter a ?1 50/50—The FIRST person’s name under entries was CONDIA. Is this necessary? And before you say he has the right to play, I understand that. In fact CONDIA if you read this send me your paypal address and I’ll send you the $1—just stay out of my SMALL scale fun. THIS IS WHAT IS WRONG WITH DFS from a casual players viewpoint

  • uscsteve

    @Agent47 said...

    Today’s statement from DraftKings:

    http://playbook.draftkings.com/uncategorized/draftkings-statement-1072015/

    Sorry if this was already posted, but I didn’t see it on the last 2-3 pages of this thread, and I just got back from lunch to find this in my news feed on Facebook.

    I was glad to see that Draftkings hadn’t hired Ted Wells to review their findings and conduct an investigation. :)

  • tnovakow

    @stevietpfl said...

    FD and DK doing a good job today, imo.

    I Agree.

    As a new player to DFS. It was frustrating to learn that someone could have a inside edge. I decided to take a wait and see approach instead of blasting a Company and/or specific person until the FACTS came out. I still have my line ups working for Sunday and expect to see an interesting outcome to this madness.

    Play on!

  • MikeMineo

    @MikeMineo said...

    Literally the only thing that was implemented before this was that employees had to sign a contract saying that using inside info would result in termination.

    I want to apologize for this inaccurate choice of words, as it’s absolutely NOT a fact that there’s only one or two protocols in place. Jason Robins only listed one or two when asked on OTL, but that certainly does not mean or imply that there are ONLY one or two data privacy protocols in place. There could be many elaborate protocols in place for all we know, so it’s certainly not literal. I should have said “Based on my personal opinion of what I perceived from the interview,” instead of “literally.” I made that mistake and will try very hard in the future to avoid incorrect word choices that separate subjectivity from objectivity when it’s impossible to do so.

    I look forward to FD/DK releasing more information on their protocols for data security, whenever that time may be. While I disagree with several of the company’s methods from a PR perspective, the effectiveness of a PR strategy is subjective and often premature to evaluate until the event has passed over. I personally think an apology from the CEO for lack of oversight would do wonders in terms of providing some regained user trust, at least in terms of assuring users that something didn’t go wrong – but it COULD with the current system in place, and new measures will be taken to prevent that (while providing detailed elaboration in regard to the additional measures – using adult-speak, not PR-speak).

  • mellofellowsu

    @Stewburtx8 said...

    I understand the idea behind this. But my issue is that I think it would just lead to everyone waiting until the very last minute to submit their lineups. People would also likely create dummy lineups to manipulate the percentages. Not sure this is the best answer.

    What that amounts to is gamesmanship. Psychological ploys. It’s a part of any competition.

    People that do their own research will be fine.

  • Zialum

    @rainbowtroutman said...

    I am a entertainment player with small stakes. Pure entertainment. I just went to sign up for fantasy feud and was going to enter a ?1 50/50—The FIRST person’s name under entries was CONDIA. Is this necessary? And before you say he has the right to play, I understand that. In fact CONDIA if you read this send me your paypal address and I’ll send you the $1—just stay out of my SMALL scale fun. THIS IS WHAT IS WRONG WITH DFS from a casual players viewpoint

    Yup. The ecosystem isn’t working right now because the best players are playing against the newer players. This will continue because multi entries allow the $1 tournaments to be crushed by people using them as $300 tournaments.

    By limiting multi entries, it is my belief that more people would be forced to move up in stakes and the game would more closely resemble poker. Great players would have to play against great players (and a few whales) if they want to play for thousands of dollars a night, which is healthy.

    In poker, you couldn’t play more than 12 tables reasonably. Some could play 24 if they were crazy and were willing to hurt their ROI for volume. There are none of these factors in DFS and the Sharks are feasting.

  • Frickman81

    @rainbowtroutman said...

    I am a entertainment player with small stakes. Pure entertainment. I just went to sign up for fantasy feud and was going to enter a ?1 50/50—The FIRST person’s name under entries was CONDIA. Is this necessary? And before you say he has the right to play, I understand that. In fact CONDIA if you read this send me your paypal address and I’ll send you the $1—just stay out of my SMALL scale fun. THIS IS WHAT IS WRONG WITH DFS from a casual players viewpoint

    Lol you guys are funny, if it’s for entertainment who cares. You can’t tell people where to play, how to play and when to play. In DFS there is always going to be winners and losers part of the game, but I have a funny feeling some of you will never be happy

  • mellofellowsu

    @rainbowtroutman said...

    I am a entertainment player with small stakes. Pure entertainment. I just went to sign up for fantasy feud and was going to enter a ?1 50/50—The FIRST person’s name under entries was CONDIA. Is this necessary? And before you say he has the right to play, I understand that. In fact CONDIA if you read this send me your paypal address and I’ll send you the $1—just stay out of my SMALL scale fun. THIS IS WHAT IS WRONG WITH DFS from a casual players viewpoint

    Meh, I beat Condia in a few NBA h2hs last season. He ain’t so bad.

  • jakeupjohnson

    @WhiskeyTavon4 said...

    This was posted two years ago in the forum. During that time in several message board posts myself and others stated that no employee of one site should be allowed to play at any other sites because of the clear conflict of interest and potential overall damage it could due to the industry. This post was the fanduel rep’s response.

    Regarding Kaetorade’s post, we’ve always been open about the fact that some of our employees at FanDuel have access to lineups. I assume that the same is true at most other sites. We could potentially limit the ability of support staff to see lineups, although it would also limit their ability to troubleshoot issues that players reported. But I have a very hard time envisioning a setup where our programmers and ops staff wouldn’t have the ability to see lineups in the database.

    Our belief is that this wouldn’t afford much of an advantage, because the pricing structures on each site are wildly different (and rosters, positions, and scoring vary as well). Regardless of that, our employees also understand that they are expected not to use this information and in fact shouldn’t be viewing this data except as needed to do their jobs.

    “We also believe that it is important for employees of sites to play on other sites. Without that happening, the industry as a whole will suffer, as everything from software to player pricing to contest types is generally going to be a lot better designed if people who play DFS are involved in the process…not to mention the additional difficulty that sites will have hiring quality employees if people know that they’ll have to quit playing DFS to work for a site.”

    Wow, so they admitted years ago they were not only privy to ownership percentages but were in fact looking at individual players lineups. Pick a top cash game guy, look at his lineup, hop on over to DK and slot it in. Free money. What a joke this industry turned out to be.

  • hendry

    @rainbowtroutman said...

    I am a entertainment player with small stakes. Pure entertainment. I just went to sign up for fantasy feud and was going to enter a ?1 50/50—The FIRST person’s name under entries was CONDIA. Is this necessary? And before you say he has the right to play, I understand that. In fact CONDIA if you read this send me your paypal address and I’ll send you the $1—just stay out of my SMALL scale fun. THIS IS WHAT IS WRONG WITH DFS from a casual players viewpoint

    see, i kinda think people complaining in caps about losing on forums is whats wrong with dfs and kills my small scale fun.

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