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  • colinwdrew

    • 186

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    • Ranked #32

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    • 2020 DraftKings FHWC Champion

    • 2018 DraftKings FHWC Finalist

    So DK tweeted out millionaire maker ownership here http://playbook.draftkings.com/nfl/millionaire-maker-percent-owned-week-3/ which as of 230pm still includes ownership data for games that have not yet started. IMO this is a big leak and should never happen. It also seems like something that your average analyst should probably not have access too, and able to tell his buddies who is owned and who the best players have. Hey did you know that CSURAM has Randall Cobb going late? Given that they can access the macro results it seems probable they can access specific users during and/or before contests start.

    They definitely should no be sharing it publicly, if they’re going to do it just list the full rosters in the contest and call it a day.

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    • Last Updated 3 years ago
  • AndThisGuyPeedOnIt

    @ebsteelers said...

    does ownership percentage guarantee that bozo batting 9th is gonna hit a granny in the 9th to cash you a gpp?

    still gotta perform

    Pretty simple minded outlook.

    Going with option 1B instead of 1A in every position with lower ownership is a massive GPP advantage in baseball. Especially on FD, when you can figure out pitcher ownership.

  • bowens1984

    • 928

      RG Overall Ranking

    • 2014 StarStreet MLB Playboy Mansion Finalist

    • RG Season Champion: NBA

    I know Ethan and I absolutely don’t think he would do anything to cheat or be dishonest.

    That being said the perception is what is in question here and the perception of anyone working in the DFS industry on one site and winning on another site is really bad for the industry as a whole.

  • realdeals

    @Stewburtx8 said...

    No, no you couldn’t. Does it have value? Sure. But you are tremendously overestimating that value. Especially when ownership percentages on Fanduel are ALREADY available from Thursday night contests.

    Knowing Sunday’s %s on the Thurs lock is helpful, but it’s not like knowing %s an hour before lock (not saying any one is doing this).
    Karlos 30% on Thursday, 42% on Sun. Forte 9 and 15. Cooper and green low 20s to high 20s, etc.
    I’m sure the Black Unicorns % was much different from Thursday to Sun. As I’m sure you know, a lot changes in the NFL from Thurs to Sun.
    Plus this is just NFL, what about MLB and NBA?

  • reztes757

    2013 DD BLB Finalist (x2)

    • 151

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    • Ranked #95

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    @tbird05 said...

    Can someone explain why DK can’t wait until everyone locks before releasing ownership percentages for Ethans little playbook blog?

    A better question would be why anyone at dk is able to access ownership data before every game had locked

  • infinite420

    dc is the gadfly on the horse that is dfs lol. always willing to speak his mind.

  • slohaylee

    @chrispm said...

    your being small minded. The ownership percentages for example on a MLB night would be insanely valuable. Do you not realize that low ownership percentage is the easiest way for you to pave your way to the top of leaderboards. How this point is going over your head is beyond me

    this needs to quoted over and over again, ownership % IS A HUGE ADVANTAGE,

    now to these big name players shouting at me in their podcasts and on these forums telling everyone it is not an advantage, you need to get a dose of reality, it would be a monster advantage in daily MLB contests where there is no such thing as Thursday ownership reports

  • dude_abides7

    @Stewburtx8 said...

    . I won’t pretend to know much about web scraping, but I know it’s forbidden by the sites.

    So was “scripting”, until it wasn’t.

  • jhorst52

    • 30

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    • Ranked #26

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    • x3

      2016 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • x2

      2016 FanDuel WFFC Finalist

    @slohaylee said...

    ownership % IS A HUGE

    +1

  • jimmyrad

    When big name syndicates circumventing entry limits by sharing lineups and millionaire’s bombarding quarter games with mass entries wasn’t killing the golden goose fast enough: The true story about how the super chummy frat boys running DFS blew the whole thing up in record time.

  • cAUmberlandtiger8

    @bowens1984 said...

    I know Ethan and I absolutely don’t think he would do anything to cheat or be dishonest.

    That being said the perception is what is in question here and the perception of anyone working in the DFS industry on one site and winning on another site is really bad for the industry as a whole.

    Agreed. Dont know Ethan but perception is reality. I hope these issues are addressed in a timely manner because the longer this goes on the worse it looks (even if it ends up being much ado about nothing) because of how much money is on the line.

  • mrchuffy

    @ebsteelers said...

    does ownership percentage guarantee that bozo batting 9th is gonna hit a granny in the 9th to cash you a gpp?

    still gotta perform

    You are missing the point. It’s not going to work every time but fading the highly owned guys for another solid player in a good matchup will shoot you up the leader board if the 30% owned guy has a crappy game. Using this knowledge you can put yourself in a better position than the rest.

  • jhorst52

    • 30

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #26

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • x3

      2016 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • x2

      2016 FanDuel WFFC Finalist

    its 4pm and its been a week, still crickets. how am i supposed to do my real job when the thing i care about most in this world is crumbling before my eyes. sites need to step up and protect the integrity of the best sports game created for fans ever. if anyone has millions and wants to start a site with me please PM

  • Stewburtx8

    • 2012 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    @realdeals said...

    Knowing Sunday’s %s on the Thurs lock is helpful, but it’s not like knowing %s an hour before lock (not saying any one is doing this).
    Karlos 30% on Thursday, 42% on Sun. Forte 9 and 15. Cooper and green low 20s to high 20s, etc.
    I’m sure the Black Unicorns % was much different from Thursday to Sun. As I’m sure you know, a lot changes in the NFL from Thurs to Sun.
    Plus this is just NFL, what about MLB and NBA?

    Well I would expect to bump up almost every fairly high owned player on Thursday a little bit come Sunday simply because Thursday players will be over-owned and no longer available on Sunday.

    And even IF Ethan knew the percentages before lock, that is for DK. DK is going to differ from FD in many instances (Karlos Williams for instance was much cheaper on DK). To me, it’s similar to knowing the percentages from Thursday night.

    I could see a greater advantage in MLB. I was mostly speaking to NFL and what caused this uproar. I don’t see the huge advantage in NFL over what is already available.

  • reztes757

    2013 DD BLB Finalist (x2)

    • 151

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    Shouldn’t people be more concerned with who supplied Ethan the info rather than Ethan. That’s the person that not only has access to this info but also not enough sense to know it shouldn’t be released to anyone prior to every game being locked

  • dude_abides7

    @jimmyrad said...

    When big name syndicates circumventing entry limits by sharing lineups and millionaire’s bombarding quarter games with mass entries wasn’t killing the golden goose fast enough: The true story about how the super chummy frat boys running DFS blew the whole thing up in record time.

    Every one of your posts regarding the industry direction spot on. This one is no different.

  • QQSTUKIE

    @Jsue said...

    How come Jon Aguilar’s name hasn’t been brought up in all of this?

    Who the heck is that?

  • Frickman81

    @jhorst52 said...

    its 4pm and its been a week, still crickets. how am i supposed to do my real job when the thing i care about most in this world is crumbling before my eyes. sites need to step up and protect the integrity of the best sports game created for fans ever. if anyone has millions and wants to start a site with me please PM

    you must be a really lonely person. have a kid or two theyll love you and this will be way down on the ladder

  • Neiderman

    • 2016 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    @Stewburtx8 said...

    No, no you couldn’t. Does it have value? Sure. But you are tremendously overestimating that value. Especially when ownership percentages on Fanduel are ALREADY available from Thursday night contests.

    Stew… Yes I could! I’m not taking about using guesstimate ownership levels from one site to the other. That would be and is helpful and yes I use the FD public info already. I’m talking about people that work at DK seeing my lu and everyone else’s. This information can not and should not be seen by anyone.
    Maybe your right Stew maybe it wouldn’t give me an advantage … But I disagree since I’ve taken down and placed high this year multiple times in big MLB Gpp’s with out any help. Give me the ownership numbers and I would dominate.
    Not to brag but my rank and recents wins should speak for them self. Ownership%=domination!!

  • jhorst52

    • 30

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    • Ranked #26

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • x3

      2016 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • x2

      2016 FanDuel WFFC Finalist

    @Frickman81 said...

    you must be a really lonely person. have a kid or two theyll love you and this will be way down on the ladder

    i like sports, money, bars, friends, girls and DFS. DFS has contributed to my happiness and success for 3 years now. think ill stick with it but thanks for the advice. if i ever grow up ill take it

  • QQSTUKIE

    hit forbes: http://www.forbes.com/sites/darrenheitner/2015/10/05/fanduel-and-draftkings-have-some-explaining-to-do/?utm_source=followingimmediate&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=20151005

  • peachfuzz

    • Blogger of the Month

    @mrchuffy said...

    You are missing the point. It’s not going to work every time but fading the highly owned guys for another solid player in a good matchup will shoot you up the leader board if the 30% owned guy has a crappy game. Using this knowledge you can put yourself in a better position than the rest.

    It isn’t just this either. It isn’t like swapping out Bryce Harper for Johnny Strikeout. It is like trading a 2.5% owned Johnny Strikeout for his 0.5% owned, and similarly talented bother Jimmy Strikeout with the exact same stats/matchup on the same team.

    Both will be low owned, and everyone knows it. Both have the same chances of scoring the same points, and there is no disputing that information is available to everyone. What does matter in this case is the ownership percentages, and knowing those ownership percentages beforehand means it matters more then lower owned the players are because that’s the only thing which really distinguishes the two.

    Sometimes Johnny will be better in a premium matchup, and sometimes Jimmy will be better in a premium matchup, but knowing their exact ownership will most certainly affect the effectiveness of playing them over time.

    I really don’t see how the pros are missing that point, especially when being contrarian, and separating yourself from the herd is such a large part of their GPP plays.

  • MikeMineo

    @bowens1984 said...

    That being said the perception is what is in question here and the perception of anyone working in the DFS industry on one site and winning on another site is really bad for the industry as a whole.

    exactly.

    I don’t know Ethan at all but am just assuming he did nothing wrong, because I have no evidence that he did and many are speaking well of him. fine, whatever. the meat of this discussion barely concerns him.

    what I’m worried about is the potential that other FD/DK employees may have in having access to data like ownership or top players’ lineup cores.

    if someone is working in DK’s tech dept and making $80k per year, and is offered $40k by a high roller to just tell him what players maxdalury has over 25% exposure to this week, then… I mean, considering there are no laws against it since the industry is unregulated, it’s going to be pretty damn hard for them to turn down half their yearly salary for copying and pasting some player names.

    this is the problem. I have no clue what sort of access the typical DK employee has to this data, but I know that at least several employees do that aren’t making massive salaries that would make them scoff at the prospect of $40k for a few player names.

  • heels123

    • x3

      2015 DraftKings FCFWC Finalist

    @mrchuffy said...

    You are missing the point. It’s not going to work every time but fading the highly owned guys for another solid player in a good matchup will shoot you up the leader board if the 30% owned guy has a crappy game. Using this knowledge you can put yourself in a better position than the rest.

    There really is no debate ownership percentage matters a lot. The first thing I do when lineups lock is look to see what percentage my players are owned. The other day Trout was 78% owned on DK and I was pissed when I saw that and wish I had not taken him. He put up a goose egg. If I had known he was that high (I was thinking he would be more in the 50% range) no doubt I would have faded him. Huge edge knowing this in advance.
    Secondly I can’t believe this has gone this long and all we have is a bunch of accusations and similarly ill-informed defenses while all we have received is a tepid response from the sites. I try to be very measured and patient in reacting to things like this but this has officially gone too far.

  • hokie2009

    @dayman said...

    The fact that Ethan got 2nd in Milly on FD has thrown this conversation way off topic. I do believe that he didn’t receive the ownership info until after lineups locked, but that’s not the issue anyway.

    Any statistical data that could in any way give any person any competitive advantage should be under lock and key until all games on that site have closed (especially on a site with late swap).

    The fact that ownership data was available to anyone while those contests were still running, whether or not they are allowed to play on the site, what’s to stop them from sharing that data with other people who can play on that site, and who can use that data to gain a competitive advantage, no matter how small that advantage may be.

    Let me be very clear that I am not accusing Ethan of sharing this data with anyone, and that’s besides the point anyway, since the onus shouldn’t be on Ethan to safeguard DK’s data, DK should be safeguarding their own data by not giving out the access to begin with.

    The argument that you shouldn’t let these employees play on other DFS sites is kind of preposterous, since what’s the point of having DFS analysts that don’t play DFS. If you want to make the argument that the DFS sites shouldn’t be in the business of giving out Fantasy Sports advice, I couldn’t agree with you more, but it seems as if that ship has already sailed.

    The simple fact is Fantasy Sports all comes down to information. The more information any one person has access to the better decisions they can make about their lineups. I think it’s great when the sites do things to level the playing field like injury updates, we want to keep the games fun for the casual players, and there’s nothing more frustrating than a player putting up a big ol’ goose egg for you because he didn’t even play. But the sites need to be cautious, even to a fault, when it comes to who has access, and when, to any data that isn’t publicly available to the entire player pool as a whole.

    Boom!

    Until FD or DK makes changes I think all future comments are going to go in circles around this same point.

    Really could just wipe the thread and sticky this and call it a day! ;-)

    Literally couldn’t have said it better myself. /thread

  • realdeals

    @Stewburtx8 said...

    Well I would expect to bump up almost every fairly high owned player on Thursday a little bit come Sunday simply because Thursday players will be over-owned and no longer available on Sunday.

    And even IF Ethan knew the percentages before lock, that is for DK. DK is going to differ from FD in many instances (Karlos Williams for instance was much cheaper on DK). To me, it’s similar to knowing the percentages from Thursday night.

    I could see a greater advantage in MLB. I was mostly speaking to NFL and what caused this uproar. I don’t see the huge advantage in NFL over what is already available.

    You’re right. Forte, etc were bad examples on my part. Black Unicorn was a good one though. I really had no idea what his % would be once Cutler was announced as starting early Sun morning vs the worst team at covering a TE. For example, if I knew he shot over 30% I wouldn’t have had him on as many teams as I did. If I knew he was only going to be 14.5% like he was, I would have put him in more Lus. I thought he’d be At least in the 20s.
    MLB and NBA it is probably a bigger issue. How many times do we have to decide lebron or durant thoughout the season?

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