INDUSTRY FORUM

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  • seth1374

    • 722

      RG Overall Ranking

    Over the last week I have noticed trains in single entry 50/50s these trains always have the same logo. They are at times 25% of the field so much so that they dictate cash lines, normally I could care less but this is so freaking blatant how is action not being taken take a look at the last couple of days:

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20730/contests/20730-210881623/entries/1254348888/scoring

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20706/contests/20706-210864249/entries/1254003171/scoring

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20691/contests/20691-210841978/entries/1253377446/scoring

    This is beyond coincidence, if this was a major site logo with RG or something people would be irate. I do not understand how fan duel allows this to go on when it is beyond blatant. When you play 50/50s you are looking for an average but right now 50/50s on FD are basically head to heads against whatever lineup that service plays. So I am done playing Fanduel 50/50s until this problem is rectified and I would encourage everybody else to do the same. Play the guranteed large field double ups its the same thing as long as Fanduel refuses to enforce their own rules

  • Roma315

    This is one reason why I have stopped playing 50/50s and double ups. I’ll play occasionally now but it’s insane how many people have the SAME lineup on a 15 game slate.

  • bigez952

    Draftkings has the same issues. I play a lot of $1 head to heads and limit my matchups to 1 per user trying to get around this and play a variaty of lineups only to commonly see 15-20% of the same lineup with the same lineup sellers picture. Nice on nights when you can beat that sold lineup but can hurt when it goes off and your against it 15-20 times. I don’t understand why people would buy lineups in the first place as that practice can’t be profitable to always be a part of a large train in cash games like that.

  • djcory27

    I believe I know the lineup seller, but cannot name them due to forum rules. They have hundreds of customers playing their lineups in cash games every night. In the big $2 double up they consist of almost 30% of the entire field. It’s been going on for months now. I’ve found the only way to avoid them is to enter 50/50s in the last hour and a half before lock, they usually only make up 10% of the field if you enter late.

  • bigez952

    @djcory27 said...

    I believe I know the lineup seller, but cannot name them due to forum rules. They have hundreds of customers playing their lineups in cash games every night. In the big $2 double up they consist of almost 30% of the entire field. It’s been going on for months now. I’ve found the only way to avoid them is to enter 50/50s in the last hour and a half before lock, they usually only make up 10% of the field if you enter late.

    How is this profitable for people to do. Just looked up their website and they charge $80 for 30 days of receiving 1 cash lineup and 4-5 GPP lineups. However if this same lineup is sold 100-200 times entering it into contests has to not be a profitable strategy since your just competing against the same lineup paying rake. It is annoying how much it has been happening lately that no matter how many head to heads you seem to get into there is a good chance your going to be playing against the same lineup in a large % of them.

  • djcory27

    @bigez952 said...

    How is this profitable for people to do. Just looked up their website and they charge $80 for 30 days of receiving 1 cash lineup and 4-5 GPP lineups. However if this same lineup is sold 100-200 times entering it into contests has to not be a profitable strategy since your just competing against the same lineup paying rake. It is annoying how much it has been happening lately that no matter how many head to heads you seem to get into there is a good chance your going to be playing against the same lineup in a large % of them.

    I’ve seen this before with other sellers that get hot. The beauty of it is once they cool down and hit a cold streak, the rest of the field not using these lineups will be cashing with ease.

  • sochoice

    • 2017 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2017 FanDuel WFFC Champion

    @seth1374 said...

    Over the last week I have noticed trains in single entry 50/50s these trains always have the same logo. They are at times 25% of the field so much so that they dictate cash lines, normally I could care less but this is so freaking blatant how is action not being taken take a look at the last couple of days:

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20730/contests/20730-210881623/entries/1254348888/scoring

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20706/contests/20706-210864249/entries/1254003171/scoring

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20691/contests/20691-210841978/entries/1253377446/scoring

    This is beyond coincidence, if this was a major site logo with RG or something people would be irate. I do not understand how fan duel allows this to go on when it is beyond blatant. When you play 50/50s you are looking for an average but right now 50/50s on FD are basically head to heads against whatever lineup that service plays. So I am done playing Fanduel 50/50s until this problem is rectified and I would encourage everybody else to do the same. Play the guranteed large field double ups its the same thing as long as Fanduel refuses to enforce their own rules

    Your examples provided certainly do seem shady and a potential problem. Hopefully FD and DK will be vigilant in looking at examples such as these when contacted. My question for you is why stop playing 50/50s or cash games in general? If there will consistently be 10-20 people with the exact same lineup and you construct a better lineup, you have a chance at instantly dogging 10%-20% of the field in a 100 person cash game every night. I don’t play MLB cash games, so haven’t taken my own advice, but if I did I would love to know that every night I get to go up against a lineup seller/sharer and his mindless followers.

  • GoldStandard000

    I noticed this last week. I am now forced to check every single 50/50 I enter to see how many AC guys are in before I enter. I shouldn’t have to do that! Come on Fanduel do something about this!

  • sonic999

    Agree with SC, why is this bad for the real dfs player. Let the monkeys follow some false guru. That type stuff never works out over time for the monkey.

  • djcory27

    @GoldStandard000 said...

    I noticed this last week. I am now forced to check every single 50/50 I enter to see how many AC guys are in before I enter. I shouldn’t have to do that! Come on Fanduel do something about this!

    I’ve found entering 50s late is your best chance at avoiding the train of 15-20 lineups from them. It boggles my mind that FanDuel has allowed this to go on for this many months. They even allowed this seller to change their FanDuel user name, which is against FanDuel rules for a known player.

  • bigez952

    @sonic999 said...

    Agree with SC, why is this bad for the real dfs player. Let the monkeys follow some false guru. That type stuff never works out over time for the monkey.

    I agree that people that buy lineups can’t be profitable long term doing that. It still takes away a lot from the game when 100+ person 50/50 turn into a head to head vs. the lineup seller. Trains like this move cash lines and really make it pointless to play 50/50’s over head to heads. The entire point of 50/50’s if they were legit is that a top 50% lineup for the night will cash and now it is not uncommon for GPP cash lines to be lower than 50/50’s since when these trains do hit they make insane cash lines.

    I can for sure see why this type of activity makes people want to stay away from cash games and just play GPP’s.

  • B_Heals152

    • 54

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #13

      RG Tiered Ranking

    50-50 lines last night on FD were absurdly high. I did notice there was almost a 10 point difference in some instances. Maybe entering closer to lock has less competitive lineups, but 50-50s are not guaranteed so you have to make sure they fill too.

  • seth1374

    • 722

      RG Overall Ranking

    So I wrote to Fanduel Customer Service pointing this out and this is the response I got:

    Hi Seth,

    Thank you for contacting FanDuel Customer Support.

    Our team has gone to great lengths to ensure we offer a fun and fair product to all of our players. Every person on the site is responsible for entering their own lineups, using their own funds.

    I can understand the frustration here, but many of our players use similar third party sites and sources when building lineups, doing research, and discussing our contests in general.

    While we cannot keep players from discussing similar strategy, we do ensure that each player is who they say they are, and carry just one account on the site.

    Please let me know if you have any other questions and I’ll be happy to help.

    Best,
    Mike

    So Basically Fanduel is endorsing that you can sell lineups and play them on their site this is a joke. Sometimes in this forum people go through extreme calculous to prove some players are colluding. Here we have a situation where someone with a 5th grade understanding of statistics can see that is going on and Fanduel does nothing

  • GoldStandard000

    @seth1374 said...

    So I wrote to Fanduel Customer Service pointing this out and this is the response I got:

    Hi Seth,

    Thank you for contacting FanDuel Customer Support.

    Our team has gone to great lengths to ensure we offer a fun and fair product to all of our players. Every person on the site is responsible for entering their own lineups, using their own funds.

    I can understand the frustration here, but many of our players use similar third party sites and sources when building lineups, doing research, and discussing our contests in general.

    While we cannot keep players from discussing similar strategy, we do ensure that each player is who they say they are, and carry just one account on the site.

    Please let me know if you have any other questions and I’ll be happy to help.

    Best,
    Mike

    So Basically Fanduel is endorsing that you can sell lineups and play them on their site this is a joke. Sometimes in this forum people go through extreme calculous to prove some players are colluding. Here we have a situation where someone with a 5th grade understanding of statistics can see that is going on and Fanduel does nothing

    Its one thing to use other sites for research, and decide on what plays you like best. Its another to have 15 people in 1 50/50 use 1 lineup. Theres a big difference!

    Thats an awful response.

  • Kjwhalen77

    The great thing is when 10 of these idiots put the same lineup in a 100-man top 12 paid league. Even if the lineup is good they’re chopping it up 10 ways.

  • djcory27

    They are going to have a massive following for NFL as well, one can only assume FanDuel will start to do something if it affects the casual NFL players from entering contests after they see what’s going on and that a quarter of the field has the same AC lineup and logo.

  • txdave41

    @sonic999 said...

    Agree with SC, why is this bad for the real dfs player. Let the monkeys follow some false guru. That type stuff never works out over time for the monkey.

    It’s bad because if their lineup is good, it jacks up the cash line and makes it much harder for low stakes guys like me to ever have a decent day. I scored over 200 last night and made a dollar profit. That’s bullshit when i see sharks score just a few points more and enjoy winning hundreds. If someone is desperate enough to buy a lineup then they are probably not playing high entry fee matches.

    The cash line in my quin matchup was a ridiculous 200 pts. Because page after page of players had the same lineup at 200.90.

  • TheRyanFlaherty

    This has been going on for a while. I used to routinely contact FanDuel, but I gave up because their response ranges from indifference to explaining how it actually is good for you.

    Personally I find it to be the most annoying issue in DFS. The comeback here to complaints used to be “build better lineups”, but you have people here who aren’t even building a lineup. For the sites it also becomes hard to argue a game of skill when this is straight up gambling.

    Also, my own personal belief is that this practice has run off many casual players. It perpetuates the “it’s rigged” narrative when you give the site a try and see a dozen duplicate lu’s pass you in a single entry 50/50. At that point you either stop, or worse you go find where to buy those lu’s.

    Yet many still act like it’s not a big issue. People complain about the edge disappearing, well a big part of that is 10-20% of losing players now playing professionally build lineups…there goes your edge, to players such as myself that were able to grind out a small profit.
    One of the most annoying things is that it’s not like it’s a mystery, many of the sellers/sites have the users blatantly use their logos as an avatar which I’d imagine attracts new customers.

    It blows. I think it’s a major reason for a personal drop in profitability and I know it’s a primary reason for me playing DFS less.

    (Sorry for the rant, but this topic always gets me going and it’s been a while since I’d seen it come up. So this was my chance at a cathartic rant)

  • djcory27

    @TheRyanFlaherty said...

    People complain about the edge disappearing, well a big part of that is 10-20% of losing players now playing professionally build lineups…there goes your edge

    This is spot on. In the Big $2 double up on FanDuel last night, there were 3,534 out of the 11,494 entries on the lineup with the AC logo. That’s 30% of the field where only 43.5% of the entries cash. This situation has completely ruined cash games and if FanDuel doesn’t do something about it, there won’t be any casual players left.

  • yisman

    @djcory27 said...

    This is spot on. In the Big $2 double up on FanDuel last night, there were 3,534 out of the 11,494 entries on the lineup with the AC logo. That’s 30% of the field where only 43.5% of the entries cash. This situation has completely ruined cash games and if FanDuel doesn’t do something about it, there won’t be any casual players left.

    Those numbers are insane.

  • bigez952

    @djcory27 said...

    Link

    Wow AC has to be raking in the cash with people paying $80 a month for access to these lineups. I can’t imagine the users are making any money splitting up whatever they win when lineups hit.

  • sonic999

    When the seller has a bad nite tho, doesnt that make it much easier to cash? Is this AC guy that great? Or is just annoying when u lose to the trains but you dont really pay attention when the train busts? I can see that is BS to allow obvious lu sellers/buyers to dominate these cash games but does it really hurt your chances overall, nite after nite?

  • djcory27

    @sonic999 said...

    When the seller has a bad nite tho, doesnt that make it much easier to cash? Is this AC guy that great? Or is just annoying when u lose to the trains but you dont really pay attention when the train busts? I can see that is BS to allow obvious lu sellers/buyers to dominate these cash games but does it really hurt your chances overall, nite after nite?

    When they lose, it’s almost an automatic cash. The problem is, they are winning at around an 80% clip over the past 2 months. It’s beyond frustrating to keep losing to a bunch of guys who wouldn’t be able to make their own lineup if their life depended on it.

  • emac

    @sonic999 said...

    When the seller has a bad nite tho, doesnt that make it much easier to cash? Is this AC guy that great? Or is just annoying when u lose to the trains but you dont really pay attention when the train busts? I can see that is BS to allow obvious lu sellers/buyers to dominate these cash games but does it really hurt your chances overall, nite after nite?

    How often are these lineup sellers really having bad nights? If the person or people creating the lineups are even close to being consistently break even, with their ever growing legions of followers they are going to dramatically swing the “cash line” in these double up and 50/50 contests, even those that are “single entry” events.

    Lineup sellers subscribe to and use many of the popular DFS services that are available. It is not like they are reaching into a hat and pulling out random names to create their lineups that they are then giving to their buyers.

    EMac

  • bigez952

    @sonic999 said...

    When the seller has a bad nite tho, doesnt that make it much easier to cash? Is this AC guy that great? Or is just annoying when u lose to the trains but you dont really pay attention when the train busts? I can see that is BS to allow obvious lu sellers/buyers to dominate these cash games but does it really hurt your chances overall, nite after nite?

    If the line up seller is a solid player it makes it much more difficult to cash night in and night out. I agree if the lineup seller sold terrible lineups it would make cash games easier but your not building a following of 3000-5000 users by building crap lineups. If AC is successful enough to convince around 5000 players to buy his lineups he obviously knows what he is doing and on average building strong lineups that makes it considerly harder for the average guy to be profitable over an extended period of time since this large train will hit more often then it flops.

  • sonic999

    So I guess he’s just that good, ok gotcha. I kinda assumed it was typical jerk off BS seller. As a gpp only guy I would love to see 30% of lus be a train lol but can see how it totally screws up the purpose behind a 50/50. Just surprised this AC is that great every night.

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