INDUSTRY FORUM

Comments

  • seth1374

    • 722

      RG Overall Ranking

    Over the last week I have noticed trains in single entry 50/50s these trains always have the same logo. They are at times 25% of the field so much so that they dictate cash lines, normally I could care less but this is so freaking blatant how is action not being taken take a look at the last couple of days:

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20730/contests/20730-210881623/entries/1254348888/scoring

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20706/contests/20706-210864249/entries/1254003171/scoring

    https://www.fanduel.com/games/20691/contests/20691-210841978/entries/1253377446/scoring

    This is beyond coincidence, if this was a major site logo with RG or something people would be irate. I do not understand how fan duel allows this to go on when it is beyond blatant. When you play 50/50s you are looking for an average but right now 50/50s on FD are basically head to heads against whatever lineup that service plays. So I am done playing Fanduel 50/50s until this problem is rectified and I would encourage everybody else to do the same. Play the guranteed large field double ups its the same thing as long as Fanduel refuses to enforce their own rules

  • krpdmb

    Just search AC fantasy lineups and you’ll figure out pretty quick. Dig deeper and you’ll see guy(s) running it are pros. This is not your typical clown selling lineups. Again I don’t fault them the issue is FD lets it happen. DK has it as unacceptable behavior, Group play behavior designed to gain an unfair advantage over others. They don’t send out direct DK lineups only FD. MLB is winding down so im not going to push it on there but if I see it on NFL with 15+ people running out the same LU on a 100 man 50/50, im signing up. FD can just continue to say they may be using the same optimizer excuse until I show them the LU I got from the site and match it up. Worth $80 to get them to change their policy.

  • deaddogseye

    Thanks — How does DK police it though?

  • krpdmb

    I have no idea but the threat of losing their accounts seems to be enough for them not to send out complete lineups for DK.

  • britdevine

    • 2014 StarStreet MLB Playboy Mansion Finalist

    Fandeul doesn’t seem to care about things like this so you have a few options.

    1. Withdraw your balance and tell FD why you did so.

    2. Stop playing on FD and tell FD why you did so

    3. Contact the NYS gaming board and aware them to the issue, perhaps enough complaints to them will force FD to take a stance.

    FD is fighting to stay alive now as they attempt to compete with DK once the merger has ended. They need every dollar of rake they can get to make the books look good for future investments, a buyout, or a possible IPO. They don;t care about the ecosystem in this part due to the fact they need any and all dollars they can get right now.

    If you are a small stakes player, you do not need to play on FD when you can play on DK, Yahoo, Fantasy draft or Draft and get more than enough action. If this bothers you, simply stop playing there and let them know why.

  • mambaland

    i really do not think FD is the only site that does not care…DK has proven over and over they also do not with TOS issues and to allow the same thing as long as your blemish it a tad bit. Bottom line is play or do not play and voicing your concern is not going to help unless your one of the ones who pay the big rake over and over. I do like they way sites still say in articles the avg rake is 10 percent. That went out window long ago. Also people throw around the word PRO and have no idea what people make or do not make unless they see the 1099 or tax statements each year.

    You are a pro when you say you are regardless of what facts are present. Seems a pro is a person with a good algorithm that spits out 150 lineups a night to max enter and hope they win a few GPP.

  • deaddogseye

    I went to the AC website and Fan Duel is listed as a partner. That’s say a lot.

  • jokerswild22

    @deaddogseye said...

    Does anyone know what the AC avatar is from? Is it for a site? Maybe somebody could do a cyber attack on them. Unfortunately I’m lucky to get my computer turned on in the morning.

    Why?

    They are doing nothing wrong.

  • joonbae

    • Blogger of the Month

    @djcory27 said...

    I believe I know the lineup seller, but cannot name them due to forum rules. They have hundreds of customers playing their lineups in cash games every night. In the big $2 double up they consist of almost 30% of the entire field. It’s been going on for months now. I’ve found the only way to avoid them is to enter 50/50s in the last hour and a half before lock, they usually only make up 10% of the field if you enter late.

    Why is it against the forum rules? If true, this makes zero sense.

  • joonbae

    • Blogger of the Month

    @britdevine said...

    Fandeul doesn’t seem to care about things like this so you have a few options.

    1. Withdraw your balance and tell FD why you did so.

    2. Stop playing on FD and tell FD why you did so

    3. Contact the NYS gaming board and aware them to the issue, perhaps enough complaints to them will force FD to take a stance.

    FD is fighting to stay alive now as they attempt to compete with DK once the merger has ended. They need every dollar of rake they can get to make the books look good for future investments, a buyout, or a possible IPO. They don;t care about the ecosystem in this part due to the fact they need any and all dollars they can get right now.

    If you are a small stakes player, you do not need to play on FD when you can play on DK, Yahoo, Fantasy draft or Draft and get more than enough action. If this bothers you, simply stop playing there and let them know why.

    Agree with all of this. Well done Brit.

  • TheRyanFlaherty

    @joonbae said...

    Why is it against the forum rules? If true, this makes zero sense.

    i’m not sure about that being a “rule” either, but I know in the past it has been seen as bad etiquette and discouraged, because it can become free advertisement.
    For every person voicing concerns there can be someone thinking, “hey I keep losing. These people are saying this person is selling profitable lineups. I’m going to check that out”.

  • jokerswild22

    It’s definitely against the rules because I’ve had posts deleted in this thread because I mentioned them.

    RG doesn’t want people leaving their site for others. Makes sense.

  • bhdevault

    • Lead Moderator

    • Blogger of the Month

    @TheRyanFlaherty said...

    For every person voicing concerns there can be someone thinking, “hey I keep losing. These people are saying this person is selling profitable lineups. I’m going to check that out”

    Bingo!

    We do not allow promotion of sites such as the one being discussed. Intentional or not, that’s exactly what it is doing, promoting them.

  • joeycis

    • Blogger of the Month

    @bhdevault said...

    @TheRyanFlaherty said…

    Bingo!

    While both comments here make a ton of sense, the interests of those losing at DFS or even RG do not change the fact that this happening is wrong and remains a black eye for an industry that continues to struggle to look legitimate. People play single-entry games to avoid multiple lineups, not to be encountered with a train and then the company shrugging their shoulders. To be honest, if they were not so over and brazen about what they are doing, people would probably be less inclined to get angry.

  • seth1374

    • 722

      RG Overall Ranking

    u hit the nail on the head they are not even trying to hide what they are doing I mean they could all choose different catchers to create some variance they don’t even bother doing that. And FD just sits there and lets them

  • jokerswild22

    It’s really not that big of a deal. I’ve seen 3 of those lineups in the last week match a model on fantasylabs.

    The users will then just use “optimizers.”

    And this is happening on both sites, not sure why people are kidding themselves by removing or suggesting to remove funds on one site.

  • djcory27

    The problem is only getting worse as they keep taking on more subs. Their train was the cash line in the big $2 double last night. There’s so many of these guys that they only got a $2.58 return on each $2 entry last night. I’m not touching this contest ever again, just scroll through the entries already in it for tonight and all you see is the AC logo. Never thought I would see the day where cash games become a H2H against a seller.

  • richierich

    This is certainly a problem. However…

    How do you police it? I don’t see a way.

  • djcory27

    @richierich said...

    How do you police it? I don’t see a way.

    You update the terms of use stating this is not allowed and will result in a ban if caught. It would take FanDuel less than an hour to find all of these accounts running this same line. As Britt stated earlier in this thread, FanDuel doesn’t care. It’s not about how to police it, it’s about the fact that they need every last dollar flowing through the system and banning this seller could have a negative impact on their bottom line.

  • txdave41

    @djcory27 said...

    You update the terms of use stating this is not allowed and will result in a ban if caught. It would take FanDuel less than an hour to find all of these accounts running this same line. As Britt stated earlier in this thread, FanDuel doesn’t care. It’s not about how to police it, it’s about the fact that they need every last dollar flowing through the system and banning this seller could have a negative impact on their bottom line.

    Fanduel once banned me immediately because I had deposited and withdrew my money in too short of a time period. It’s funny that they have such strict rules about things like that yet allow this to go on. While I don’t see how they could tell someone that they can’t play a particular lineup, they could run simple queries to see if someone is playing the same lineups as other users over multiple days. They reserve the right to kick you off their service if they want.

    I doubt they will do anything unless their customer base drops significantly. It’s bad enough that sharks have ruined H2H. It’s impossible to join a lobby H2H game that is not hosted by a shark. Fanduel did nothing to stop that. So they don’t care about lineup sellers either.

  • deaddogseye

    @djcory27 said...

    The problem is only getting worse as they keep taking on more subs. Their train was the cash line in the big $2 double last night. There’s so many of these guys that they only got a $2.58 return on each $2 entry last night. I’m not touching this contest ever again, just scroll through the entries already in it for tonight and all you see is the AC logo. Never thought I would see the day where cash games become a H2H against a seller.

    Yes good point and I do that but keep in mind there are a lot of them who don’t use the logo. In the games I see them in there are more of their subs who don’t use the logo than do — far more. I’d estimate about 3-1.

  • TheRyanFlaherty

    I’ll spare everyone a lengthy post on how they could fully police it, because it seems like pure fantasy for that to happen.
    If you went that route it would also bring up a lot of other discussions of interest – such as would enforcing it in single entry be enough or what to do with smaller slates where unintentional duplicate entries are likely.
    Instead I do believe just an admission that it is an issue, and some change to the TOS would at lest curb a good portion of the problem. Basically what DK has done…

    We can argue about how much DK really enforces the rules, but by simply having them keeps some sites/sellers away. Plus you have the sites (like this one) force you to at least choose two players before spitting out an Optimal Lineup.
    Again, not perfect, but better than nothing.
    It’s like a store having security cameras everywhere, but no one monotoring them…you won’t really stop anybody, but the presence will deter most.

    (Also, if it’s not evident from my posts, I’d advocate/prefer trying to fully eliminate the practice. But I was presenting this as literally the least they could (and should) be doing to help)

  • djcory27

    I’m officially pulling my bankroll off of FanDuel and emailed them as to why. Went to enter some 50/50s for tonight’s slate and there are 15 AC logo accounts plus another 10 or so more that I recognize playing those lines. I’ve been a cash game FanDuel player for the last 3 years, typically wagering $150-$250 a night in doubles and 50s. I’ve been good enough to sustain a 65% cash rate, keeping me profitable, but it’s deteriorated significantly these past two months due to a mass of bad players getting premium lines from this highly ranked pro. It’s out of control, the only way we’ll get change is by pulling our funds and moving to another site.

  • easternmh

    • 2019 Blogger of the Month

    lol they’re up to 33/100 people in 50/50s tonight

  • jokerswild22

    @TheRyanFlaherty said...

    Plus you have the sites (like this one) force you to at least choose two players before spitting out an Optimal Lineup.

    this has been the most laughable adjustment of all to “neutralize” optimizers.

    Everyone who plays DFS knows 2 players they want to play.

    And everyone who owns an optimizer site can simply say “Here are 2 guys we are locking in today.”

    This entire issue has been a useless witch hunt for years.

  • coyotes01

    May seem like an dumb idea, but if RG agrees that this practice is bad for business why not allow a member to sign up for this website, receive the lineup, and post it to a specific forum post each day. Allow the member to create a separate RG profile so that the site owner can’t figure out the person posting their lineups.

    This could allow RG individuals to enter the lineup and potentially shift the returns to losses even when the lineup cashes(If people want to risk their money to create a change). Assuming people figure out that the lineup is posted free here it could also potentially get them to cancel their subscriptions from the website and negatively impacted the business model of the lineup seller. Extremely unlikely RG would allow it, but it may be food for thought….or a terrible idea.

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