INDUSTRY FORUM

Comments

  • yeahthisiscuddy

    But the data says that if you’re looking to make money, DFS is a losing bet for most people.

    “In the first half of the 2015 MLB season, 91% of daily fantasy sports player profits were won by just 1.3% of players,” write the authors Ed Miller and Dan Singer.

    The mass majority of people are “fish.” “[Five] percent of players are the big fish; they lost $1,100 on entry fees of $3,600 on average,” Miller and Singer say. “[Eighty] percent of players were the minnows; they lost $25 on entry fees of $49 on average.”

    http://www.techinsider.io/fantasy-football-favors-the-sharks-heavily-over-the-fish-2015-9

  • Richebee

    Dude, LIFE favors the sharks.

  • ComicFx

    Life is who you know. DFS is what you know. Work hard. Somebody is working harder right now.

  • scottmsteiner

    Be the 1.3%. That should be your goal.

  • mannmicj

    @ComicFx said...

    Life is who you know. DFS is what you know. Work hard. Somebody is working harder right now.

    Exactly. My goal is to kick butt at DFS. To reach that goal I will be busting my butt researching and building my OWN lineups. If I don’t win in a given day, that’s on me.

    Either play and learn, or don’t play. It’s that simple.

  • xandamere

    No offense intended, but you’re basically just saying “this game of skill favors people who are better at it.” I think that’s pretty obvious.

  • Zialum

    You guys are dismissing this, but it’s significant.

    If you can guarantee you win at Heads or Tails 55% of the time, you will make a lot of money.

    If you can guarantee you win at Heads or Tails 90% of the time, nobody will play you.

    Of course you should strive to be the best, but if the best players can push their edge too much, there won’t be a game left. Public perception is that this game is not fair right now.

  • whybore

    Is it really that surprising that most of the money is won by the top 1.3%? Between the pros who play the most volume and the players who win the massive tourneys with very top heavy payouts such as the Milly Makers. Obviously that is going to be where most of the profits are going to be located.

  • MikeSos760

    It makes sense considering those big tournaments are for the most part sink pits for your money unless you get really lucky or have the bankroll to deal with huge losing streaks and most people play the big tournaments instead of the smaller league play or 50/50s.

  • nawmsayin

    • 293

      RG Overall Ranking

    I’ve read numerous articles like this recently, but isn’t this biased towards the fact that a very small percentage of players play high stakes. There are a ton of high buy in tournaments a small percentage of people play that have very high returns.

  • rsigler65

    This article is essentially saying “poeple who buy more spend more.” It’s largely about volume, not edge.

  • Theproducer

    Another way of saying this is, that every 99 people playing playing DFS… are paying 1 guy (and while the investigation is sorting itself out) DK and FD better hope that 1 guy is not a FD or DK employee!!

  • Theproducer

    In other words: 98.7% percent of the people playing DFS are playing for 9% of the winnings…. NOT GOOD ODDS!

  • jbergey

    Clearly the million dollar makers skew the numbers. Plenty of people out there rolling in 10-30k per year that are happy with their hobby.

  • wikingfan

    @ComicFx said...

    Life is who you know. DFS is what you know. Work hard. Somebody is working harder right now.

    ^This
    I started playing DFS last summer with $100 playing low volume small stakes by the end of the summer I was cashing GPP’s in the hundreds of $‘s. Then Football last year by the end of the season I was cashing in the low thousands of $‘s. NBA season comes and by the end of the season I was cashing high thousands $‘s . MLB season this year and I cashed in the tens of thousands $‘s.

    I am 40+ years old and have a much better life after 1 year in DFS than I had in almost 20 years in middle management.

  • sethayates

    @yeahthisiscuddy said...

    But the data says that if you’re looking to make money, DFS is a losing bet for most people.

    “In the first half of the 2015 MLB season, 91% of daily fantasy sports player profits were won by just 1.3% of players,” write the authors Ed Miller and Dan Singer.

    The mass majority of people are “fish.” “[Five] percent of players are the big fish; they lost $1,100 on entry fees of $3,600 on average,” Miller and Singer say. “[Eighty] percent of players were the minnows; they lost $25 on entry fees of $49 on average.”

    http://www.techinsider.io/fantasy-football-favors-the-sharks-heavily-over-the-fish-2015-9

    I’m very confused by how the article you are quoting proves your title. Allow me to summarize your argument. During Baseball season, 91% of the profits were won by 1.3% of the players. This means that Fantasy Football favors the sharks.

  • thechampisback

    @sethayates said...

    I’ve very confused by how the article you are quoting proves your title. Allow me to summarize your argument. During Baseball season, 91% of the profits were won by 1.3% of the players. This means that Fantasy Football favors the sharks.

    This^

    And this: Almost half of the world’s wealth is now owned by just one percent of the population.

  • yeahthisiscuddy

    @sethayates said...

    I’ve very confused by how the article you are quoting proves your title. Allow me to summarize your argument. During Baseball season, 91% of the profits were won by 1.3% of the players. This means that Fantasy Football favors the sharks.

    I was just quoting the title of the article , which in my opinion wasn’t a good one. I think the table they presented though is great and worthy of discussion.

  • yeahthisiscuddy

    @jbergey said...

    Clearly the million dollar makers skew the numbers. Plenty of people out there rolling in 10-30k per year that are happy with their hobby.

    If you’re describing yourself there then congratulations! You’re the little shark from the graphic and part of the top 1.3%. Still the vast majority of players have a negative ROI.

  • rsigler65

    According to the chart in the article I’m a little shark. I started with $100 dollars and worked my way up over 2 years. A lot of hard work and long hours. I’d like to continue with my ‘American dream.’ To me it feels like I’m hearing a lot of “we just want to play casually and have fun, but we don’t like how hard it is to win.” Am I missing something?

  • yeahthisiscuddy

    @ComicFx said...

    Life is who you know. DFS is what you know. Work hard. Somebody is working harder right now.

    If you consider scripting, mass multientry, and exploiting a system tailored for those folks to suck in the majority of winnings “working harder”, then I agree with you.

  • yeahthisiscuddy

    @rsigler65 said...

    According to the chart in the article I’m a little shark. I started with $100 dollars and worked my way up over 2 years. A lot of hard work and long hours. I’d like to continue with my ‘American dream.’ To me it feels like I’m hearing a lot of “we just want to play casually and have fun, but we don’t like how hard it is to win.” Am I missing something?

    If you have an edge pickin lineups, it would only increase if the system stopped allowing mass exploitation by the maxdalury types out there that can enter every contest. You should be pushing for a more even playing field.

  • rsigler65

    You might be right. I guess I feel like it’s disingenuous to put the message out that single entry is the savior for ‘the regular players’. It almost seems like hype to bring in new players. I find single entry tournaments more like a lottery than anything else. I feel like it’s all about being able to pick the right player pool and multi-entry. I really am trying to understand your point of view though. I would like the industry to be fair and fun for everyone, but not just the newer casual players.

  • mannmicj

    Ok. Let’s look at it a different way. It’s all about payout structure. It you have to finish in the top 0.01% to win the big money, then it’s understandable that 1.3% of the players would win the majority of the money.

    1.3% of the next milly maker on DK would be 5209th place if it filled. Finishing between 4000th and 6000th place pays $75.00. Go look at all the prize money paid above this position. That is why the math looks so bad. It’s the payout structure in these HUGE GPP’s, that pay out the most money every week. The payout structure of massive field GPPs skew the data.

    Consider this, the top 10 in the next milly maker are the top 0.0025% of all entries if it fills up. The same top 10, would win $2,455,000 of the $7,000,000 prize pool (35.07% of total).

    So, we have the largest tournament paying the top 0.0025% a grand total of 35.07% of the prize money. Can you see where this is going? It’s all about payout structure.

    If you take all the money DK pays out in winnings, how much of that goes to folks who finish in the top 1.3% of every contest. This number is being thrown around without perspective. The media likes this number, but doesn’t discuss payout structure. While the Milly Makers are the extreme in payout structure, all of the massive field GPP’s have a similar payout design. When you combine these payout structures with your ridiculously low odds of winning a huge GPP you can easily see how 1.3% would win most of the money. Just the select company you would be in by winning a huge GPP would put you in that same 1.3% of people.

    Just a different way of looking at it.

  • thechampisback

    @yeahthisiscuddy said...

    If you have an edge pickin lineups, it would only increase if the system stopped allowing mass exploitation by the maxdalury types out there that can enter every contest. You should be pushing for a more even playing field.

    I do not understand why you pick on Max so much. He probably worked really hard to know all the mathematical knowledge he has and even harder to apply that knowledge into DFS. Why is that unfair? Just because majority of us does not have that knowledge? If he is smart enough to create scripts that work and allow him to do that why should he stop? He had to learn a lot of things to be able to create all the tools. I do not think we should pick much on the players that do that, instead pick on the sites that allow that to happen.

  • travs424

    Sharks will always win, they are setup with spreadsheets, info, and the time that the normal guy with a job doesnt have. They win a lot but they also play a lot of money every night. so it is not all profit. and it is there job, if this is all you did every day you would win more.

    There was once a site called draftstreet, They offered h2h, 3 man, 6 man , 10 man live draft leagues. it took the shark spreadsheets, algorithms, and cheat sheets out of the picture. there were guys that just played live draft leagues and were very profitable at it. Live drafts were so much fun it should have been illegal

    I dont know why someone just doesnt copy the DS format and create a site, worst case scenerio is Draft kings will pay you millions of dollars to buy your site and dissolve your site for you.

  • X Unread Thread
  • X Thread with New Replies*
  • *Jumps to your first unread reply

Subforum Index

RotoGrinders.com is the home of the daily fantasy sports community. Our content, rankings, member blogs, promotions and forum discussion all cater to the players that like to create a new fantasy team every day of the week.

If you or someone you know has a gambling problem, crisis counseling and referral services can be accessed by calling 1-800-GAMBLER (1-800-426-2537) (IL). Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (NJ/WV/PA/MI), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (CO), 1-800-BETS OFF (IA), 1-888-532-3500 (VA) or call/text TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN).