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  • mambaland

    I noticed on a single entry 4pm mix up contest rake is 15.38% is this the new norm that sites will go to soon? What % would you no longer pay? I thought 12% would be my mark but i went over it but i know darn well i will not touch anything at more than 15 percent
    $7 [15.38%] this was the rake

  • JustDFSin

    @mambaland said...

    I noticed on a single entry 4pm mix up contest rake is 15.38% is this the new norm that sites will go to soon? What % would you no longer pay? I thought 12% would be my mark but i went over it but i know darn well i will not touch anything at more than 15 percent
    $7 [15.38%] this was the rake

    Sad thing is a lot of people don’t even understand what rake. Secondly, a lot of people are addicted so they could keep increasing the rate with no problems. Just wait for the start of football season

  • Roma315

    The rakes have been getting insane. I have considerably dropped down how much I play. It sucks because baseball is one of my best sports in terms of profit. I see this becoming a norm and if that’s the case more people will wake up and do the same. They had similar rake for the $7 event on Friday while eliminating all close gpps. It was only the $7 ($200k) $44, and $666 I believe. The only other close event was the $2 20 max $10k

  • TheRyanFlaherty

    Sadly, the first response is pretty accurate.

    This also makes me want to throw out a “told you so” to everyone that bitched and moaned about the potential merger and how it would cause take increases, when all logic indicated the exact opposite and the merger was the best chance at reversing the trend…I wouldn’t hold my breath for it to get better anytime soon.

    As for your specific question. I don’t always look at rake, but like everything it directly and indirectly affects my play….every little change in payout structure, rake, whatever has made it harder for me (someone who in the past was able to grind out a small profit or be barely above break even) to make a profit. If I’m just losing money it makes me less likely to want to play and redeposit if I lose my money.
    I’ve cut my play back considerably the last few months. There isn’t really a magic number alone that will get me to stop playing…but it’s played a role (along with other issues) that have made it tougher to win, which has contributed to me playing less.

  • MrSnuffleupagus

    @TheRyanFlaherty said...

    Sadly, the first response is pretty accurate.

    This also makes me want to throw out a “told you so” to everyone that bitched and moaned about the potential merger and how it would cause take increases, when all logic indicated the exact opposite and the merger was the best chance at reversing the trend…I wouldn’t hold my breath for it to get better anytime soon.

    As for your specific question. I don’t always look at rake, but like everything it directly and indirectly affects my play….every little change in payout structure, rake, whatever has made it harder for me (someone who in the past was able to grind out a small profit or be barely above break even) to make a profit. If I’m just losing money it makes me less likely to want to play and redeposit if I lose my money.
    I’ve cut my play back considerably the last few months. There isn’t really a magic number alone that will get me to stop playing…but it’s played a role (along with other issues) that have made it tougher to win, which has contributed to me playing less.

    Even if they merged, Rake will still go up

  • depalma13

    @TheRyanFlaherty said...

    This also makes me want to throw out a “told you so” to everyone that bitched and moaned about the potential merger and how it would cause take increases, when all logic indicated the exact opposite and the merger was the best chance at reversing the trend…I wouldn’t hold my breath for it to get better anytime soon.

    The rake would have been much higher with a merge. Horse racing has competition and their rake is much higher. Just wait until both Fanduel and Draftkings figure out just how much the tracks are raking.

    http://www.sportsbettingacumen.com/horse-racing/takeout-chart-north-american-racetracks

  • MrFantasy

    At this point it would be better if the rake went to 20%. At 20% you will have every shark staying out of the GPP’s and play only cash games. It sounds crazy but it would be better for the player ecosystem long term. It would decrease the profits of the sites though because no pro’s would be left.

  • WidumBoise

    @MrFantasy said...

    At this point it would be better if the rake went to 20%. At 20% you will have every shark staying out of the GPP’s and play only cash games. It sounds crazy but it would be better for the player ecosystem long term. It would decrease the profits of the sites though because no pro’s would be left.

  • mambaland

    @MrFantasy said...

    At this point it would be better if the rake went to 20%. At 20% you will have every shark staying out of the GPP’s and play only cash games. It sounds crazy but it would be better for the player ecosystem long term. It would decrease the profits of the sites though because no pro’s would be left.

    i agree with this. Most revenue is now generated by about 10 % of players as casual players slow down. I played every day for the past 2 years and while not a ton it was constant stream of cash. NOW i take days off and just buy a few lotto tix or scratch offs. Yea that is just as stupid but silences the urge to have something at stake

  • mattyice522

    plus they tailor the sizes of the gpps where it would be impossible for it not to fill or for there to be overlay

  • bhdevault

    • Lead Moderator

    • Blogger of the Month

    @mambaland said...

    Most revenue is now generated by about 10 % of players as casual players slow down.

    Please let’s not speculate without some facts to back that up. I am not sure of the numbers, but you are making it look like it’s a fact there, is it?

  • MrFantasy

    @WidumBoise said...

    If raising the rake to 20% means 20 pros quit playing because they don’t profit at 20% rake then it removes more than 5% of players from the contest. Difference between 15% and 20% rake is 5%. You now have a softer contest and a higher ROI simply by having a higher rake.

    Rake is trending higher anyways. It’s only a matter of time until they do start taking 20% out of GPPs. Pokerstars uses the same model. They got rid of rakeback type rewards in favor of random drawings that create more excitement for recreational players. If players were breaking even or barely winning they will now stop playing. It’s not any different than how several USA friendly poker sites ban players for winning too much. In order to create a fun environment for players these things need to be done.

  • joephoto

    Because of the growth of rake I find myself playing a lot of $20 – 3 player pools where the rake is $6 (or 10%).
    Winner gets $54.

  • RangerC

    @MrFantasy said...

    At this point it would be better if the rake went to 20%. At 20% you will have every shark staying out of the GPP’s and play only cash games. It sounds crazy but it would be better for the player ecosystem long term. It would decrease the profits of the sites though because no pro’s would be left.

    Problem is that rake is inconsistent across contests right now –

    DK:

    $1-10: Usually 15%
    $12-33: Usually 13.5%
    ~$50: Usually ~12%
    100-500: Usually 9-10%
    $530 and up: Between 5-6%

    I doubt that the 15% raked games are profitable for anyone, but pros still play them because their effective rake for a slate is around 8-10% depending on spread of entries. IMO there is some implicit collusion here (note I did not say explicit) – pros will continue to multienter everything (even if rake is 20% on low stakes contests) as long as they still have access to 10% and under contests and have an overall rake rate that is beatable.

  • FantasyDraft_Rep

    • FantasyDraft Representative

    Worth noting our rake is always <13%, including RAKE-FREE H2H contests across all sports.

    We added the ability to create your own public/private rake-free H2H contests last week and are adding H2H player blocking this week.

    MUCH larger GPPs coming for NFL!

  • Trillexx

    its also worth noting that FantasyDraft never offers free rolls or has late swap for any sport and rarely offers split slates..but It’s the only alternative to the other big 2..and if you live and die via H2Hs fantasydraft is the place to play

  • joephoto

    @FantasyDraft_Rep said...

    Worth noting our rake is always <13%, including RAKE-FREE H2H contests across all sports.

    I will be returning to FantasyDraft for football.
    The only site I’ll need.
    Love you guys.

  • jjwd

    @bhdevault said...

    Please let’s not speculate without some facts to back that up. I am not sure of the numbers, but you are making it look like it’s a fact there, is it?

    Thank goodness. We need mods to call BS on misinfo more often.

  • FantasyDraft_Rep

    • FantasyDraft Representative

    @Trillexx said...

    its also worth noting that FantasyDraft never offers free rolls or has late swap for any sport and rarely offers split slates..but It’s the only alternative to the other big 2..and if you live and die via H2Hs fantasydraft is the place to play

    We do run freerolls on occasion, you have played in them.

    Keep an eye out for a much larger freeroll to welcome everyone back to NFL!

  • ocdobv

    @jjwd said...

    Thank goodness. We need mods to call BS on misinfo more often.

    If it’s not true, then it’s pretty close.

    Just take the rally yesterday. There were 14400 entries by 4750 people. 33 people max entered 150 lineups. Those 33 players were 0.7% of the contestants, but they made up 34.4% of the entries. If you take the 475 players (10%) with most entries, then get 9045 (62.8%) of the total entries.

    Of course, this is just 1 gpp, but I’d be surprised if the top 10% of players did not may not make up over 50% of the revenue in MLB right now. It’s probably even higher on FD where there’s more 150 max entry contests.

  • Nosuckoutplz

    @FantasyDraft_Rep said...

    Worth noting our rake is always <13%, including RAKE-FREE H2H contests across all sports.

    We added the ability to create your own public/private rake-free H2H contests last week and are adding H2H player blocking this week.

    MUCH larger GPPs coming for NFL!

    I need to make a public promise to deposit, support and play on your site by the start of NFL. Have had an account for a couple years and continue to remind myself I need and want to get back to playing there, and then I don’t.

    So I’m going to offer everyone who’s posted in this thread up until this point, $10 (PayPal) if I haven’t deposited and entered a game on your site by NFL week 1.

    And so there’s a positive both ways, if I cash over $200 in week one on FantasyDraft, I’ll give 15% of profit, split among the same (posters up to this post).

    Person who “calls me out/bumps this post” on week 1 lock gets bonus $20 if I haven’t deposited and played or bonus 5% of profit if so. I obviously need to create a fire under my ass to motivate me to do something I keep forgetting to do 🙄

    Hold me to it. Thanks

  • FantasyDraft_Rep

    • FantasyDraft Representative

    You won’t be disappointed.

    We have big plans for this NFL season.

  • Olhausen

    @TheRyanFlaherty said...

    Sadly, the first response is pretty accurate.

    This also makes me want to throw out a “told you so” to everyone that bitched and moaned about the potential merger and how it would cause take increases, when all logic indicated the exact opposite and the merger was the best chance at reversing the trend…I wouldn’t hold my breath for it to get better anytime soon.

    As for your specific question. I don’t always look at rake, but like everything it directly and indirectly affects my play….every little change in payout structure, rake, whatever has made it harder for me (someone who in the past was able to grind out a small profit or be barely above break even) to make a profit. If I’m just losing money it makes me less likely to want to play and redeposit if I lose my money.
    I’ve cut my play back considerably the last few months. There isn’t really a magic number alone that will get me to stop playing…but it’s played a role (along with other issues) that have made it tougher to win, which has contributed to me playing less.

    Before the SiriusXM merger I was paying 7-8$ a month. Now it’s 15-20$ a month so I can assure you if dk and FD had merged it would not have prevented a rake hike.

  • jjwd

    @ocdobv said...

    Of course, this is just 1 gpp, but I’d be surprised if the top 10% of players did not may not make up over 50% of the revenue in MLB right now. It’s probably even higher on FD where there’s more 150 max entry contests.

    Big respect for you sir. I’m just generally tired of people throwing out numbers and accusations, and dire predictions… with no evidence. But I don’t know the particulars of this situation.

  • Houseman

    Is FantasyDraft gone already. No website availability just hours before first pitch

  • bhdevault

    • Lead Moderator

    • Blogger of the Month

    @Houseman said...

    Is FantasyDraft gone already. No website availability just hours before first pitch

    Working fine for me.

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