INDUSTRY FORUM

  • ctrain03

    I admit I’m a bit of a conspiracy theorist. But do you really think the government does not want a piece of a multibillion dollar pie? With all that money also brings more power. So now what happens. Some stuff goes down and we will see the government use their favorite weapon: fear. Get everybody to be afraid that DFS are corrupt and need to be federally regulated. Then they swoop in and have some yummy pie just in time for the holidays.

  • BobGrinder

    What part of they already get taxes off of both player winnings over $600 per player per year and off of any profits made by the sites do you “the government wants their cut” people not comprehend?

  • JEFFRAMBO

    @ctrain03 said...

    I admit I’m a bit of a conspiracy theorist.

    So your post should have ended right there. Fear mongering posts like yours is what will do more harm than good to DFS as it will be seen by the uninformed casual player who is incapable of seeing past it for what it truly is.

    Any DFS winnings by U.S. based players in excess of $600 in a calendar year are already federally taxed and the site operators are required by law to issue a 1099 to them. So as Bob already posed… what additional slices of pie do you think they are going to be taking?

    Let me paint a picture of pie for you- The latest rounds of FanDuel commercials say they are paying out $75M a week during football season alone. $75M x 16 = breaks my iPhone calculator. But switching to the Yahoo! calculator shows me that is 1.2 billion. Using a conservative percentage of 20% as the mean withholding… the Government’s pie is already at $240M. That’s from one site over a single season of football using a somewhat conservative percentage. Now multiply that x2 for the big two players and you are already at nearly half a billion. Now add in the rest of the site operators out there, the rest of the sports seasons, and subtract a bit for non U.S. players. Ballpark? A bit over $1B in withholdings. I think the pie is quite big already and no need for anything other than regulation to ensure the pie continues to get baked every day.

    Your rotogrinders rankings tell me you have won sizable amounts that exceed the tax threshold so either you haven’t been issued a 1099 yet or you have withholding/compliance issues. Which is it?

  • whybore

    @BobGrinder said...

    What part of they already get taxes off of both player winnings over $600 per player per year and off of any profits made by the sites do you “the government wants their cut” people not comprehend?

    This is the big difference between the current state of DFS and poker before Black Friday. The sites are issueing forms for income and are also located in the US. So they have teeth to go after the companies if they don’t file these forms and can have real consequences.

    In poker the reported income had to have been much less than the income that was coming in and that’s what the government really wants regardless of the public’s stance on the morality of the act. Since the income forms are reported they are much more likely to get their cut and it is much easier for them to go after people who aren’t reporting the income that is being reported to them.

  • S1nsear

    Winnings are taxed. I’m sure any profit the companies make are taxed as well. What more could they want?

  • einars

    @JEFFRAMBO said...

    Any DFS winnings by U.S. based players in excess of $600 in a calendar year are already federally taxed and the site operators are required by law to issue a 1099 to them.

    and actually winnings that are over 0 (would be winnings if it was below 0 i guess lol) but less than 600 are still taxable, the company just doesnt need to issue a 1099. the individual is still required to pay taxes on $400 of winnings

  • oilydave

    This is a huge festering boil that needs to be lanced.

    I’m going pull my bankroll out while I can and wait for the dust to settle.

    The Fox will be in the Hen House shortly.

    We are going to hear from the Organ Grinder and not the Monkeys

  • johnnyj580

    @oilydave said...

    This is a huge festering boil that needs to be lanced.

    I’m going pull my bankroll out while I can and wait for the dust to settle.

    The Fox will be in the Hen House shortly.

    We are going to hear from the Organ Grinder and not the Monkeys

    I’m clicking ‘like’ solely because I don’t know what any of this means!

  • oilydave

    @johnnyj580 said...

    I’m clicking ‘like’ solely because I don’t know what any of this means!

    “So that makes us robbers of robbers,” said Bug, “who pretend to be robbers working for a robber of other robbers.”
    ― Scott Lynch, The Lies of Locke Lamora

  • BobGrinder

    @tclii85 said...

    The sites are not profitable so the gov’t doesnt get anything there. If players properly report and pay there will be some additional revenue from that but no more than a blip on the radar. It is likely they are going to get involved at some point. If you think otherwise you are being naive. It is not conspiracy theory it is reality that a huge industry with massive amounts of money will attract gov’t scrutiny at some point.

    Casinos/racetracks are already required to collect the taxes from the payout on any jackpot over $600. I seriously doubt DFS jackpots are handled any differently.

    Most businesses are not profitable in the beginning…

  • bbjay20

    If the gov’t wanted as much of the pie as possible, sports gambling, online poker, etc would all be 100% legal everywhere. it’s all about regulation and compliance right now, I’d imagine.

  • DabsAndFrags

    The hypocrisy in a fear driven post, alluding to the government using scare tactics for motivation. Priceless.

  • TnRiddles

    • Blogger of the Month

    These types of threads are not doing us DFS grinders any favors. The “sky is falling” crap lends to fear for people and draws unwanted attention. All the while , people just make threads , tweets , etc to draw attention to themselves

  • ctrain03

    You guys are funny thinking that taxes to the IRS is enough for the government. It’s pittance. They want to create more jobs and get a much bigger piece.

  • ctrain03

    You think $240 million is a lot to the government. Take out your calculator and divide that into the national debt

  • ctrain03

    You guys are all off the mark. It’s not as much about money as it is power and control. Government has moved more and more into an area where they want control of everything. But whatever, I won’t go into all that I was just giving my two cents

    I like dfs. This is a side note, but it’s weird I won so easily on draftstreet but not as much on draftkings.

  • ctrain03

    Those of you accusing me of fear mongering are being ridiculous. I am saying that government is using fear themselves to get people to demand regulation. I am against government regulation of DFS

  • ctrain03

    Nevada gaming commission is a powerful regulation branch. They are not allowing gambling to be legal everywhere. And by the way, what do u call all these Indian casino?

  • dictator_teddy

    • 212

      RG Overall Ranking

    • 2017 DraftKings FHWC Finalist

    @JEFFRAMBO said...

    Any DFS winnings by U.S. based players in excess of $600 in a calendar year are already federally taxed and the site operators are required by law to issue a 1099 to them.

    Yahoo DFS does not issue 1099 for winnings. Does this mean they are breaking the law? It is stated in their FAQ.

  • bookersnookers

    The sticky part is going to be- Do they tax your winnings or what you withdraw out of your account.

  • steveospeak

    I’ll take it a step further why the Government would be wise to not get involved.

    In addition to any taxes they collect from the players and these sites, DFS is a growing industry one that is starting to employ more and more people and these companies are extremely aggressive with their advertising so that money is being spread out in the economy. In addition it’s created a market for content about DFS. Not only do you have great sites like Rotogrinders producing this content and hiring/paying people, but even big sites like ESPN, CBS, Yahoo etc are bringing on new people to focus on DFS.

    Now obviously the Fantasy market in general was doing some of these things, but it’s clearly exploded and it is growing.

  • whybore

    @bookersnookers said...

    The sticky part is going to be- Do they tax your winnings or what you withdraw out of your account.

    The forms filed by the sites show your winnings not the amount you’ve withdrawn.

  • deactivated84892

    I may have misunderstood what you are saying but I think you’re saying that all prizes over $600 paid out by DFS sites are taxed on site.

    If this is what you are saying, then I would just like to chime in and let you know that is not correct.

    You are paid the full prize and expected to pay taxes on your own. THAT is something that I can see government changing.

  • Taterchipdip

    Gee I thought most DFS players were college educated smart people. This thread is making me doubt our education system BIG TIME.

  • Jimmywil

    Was the tin foil hat sub forum made yet?

  • JEFFRAMBO

    @gundacker said...

    I may have misunderstood what you are saying but I think you’re saying that all prizes over $600 paid out by DFS sites are taxed on site.

    If this is what you are saying, then I would just like to chime in and let you know that is not correct.

    You are paid the full prize and expected to pay taxes on your own. THAT is something that I can see government changing.

    This is correct. But the 1099 you are issued is copied to the IRS showing the amount issued to you. Therefore if you under report your yearly earnings, you will receive correspondence from the withholdings compliance department of the IRS. I know this to be fact as I forgot about a jackpot I won at a San Diego card room back in 2011. During the 2012 tax year, I received a compliance notice with a photo copy of the W2G that was issued. The same would be the case for a 1099.

    The IRS would not get into the habit of requiring DFS sites to withhold taxes before withdrawal as the precedent has already been set by the gaming industry to allow full withdrawal to the customer with the option for advanced withholdings. That is a precedent that would easily be upheld as the same standard of measure applies; which would be calling for enforcement from the compliance withholdings division of the IRS to deal with a taxpayer problem as it would not be a DFS site operator problem given that they are doing their part by reporting/issuing the 1099s.

    As far as the Yahoo! DFS question- I am uncertain of how they are skirting things by not issuing a 1099. That’s a question that I would invite being answered by someone much smarter than I in the area of withholdings compliance.

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