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  • DatDerFranny

    Is this guy actually a winning player? He seems like an ok guy and all, but…

    and I really dont want to come across as a jerk, but when I listen on Sirius, he can barely speak… Hes constantly using and butchering cliches and stumbling on his words. And it doesnt appear to be from nervousness. The purpose of the show seems mainly to me to be a a promo for Fanduel. He also uses fuzzy math for things like, as an example yesterday, he claimed he cashed at a higher rate this week in 50/50s with a smaller number of participants which made the point score pay line lower, as opposed to 50/50s with a larger amount of entries because the pay line cut line is higher ones with more players. Sure, the cut line in a smaller field 50/50 has a greater chance than a larger entry 50/50 for being lower, but it also has a higher chance as well… its called standard deviation. And no he wasnt saying he cashed because the pay lines were lower… he was saying that smaller field 50/50s have lower point score pay lines as a fact. Reasons he gave in passing were youre not going up as many lineups.

    Again, all that increases is the deviation from the mean. he does this sort of thing frequently.

  • JEFFRAMBO

    Interesting you posted this. About an hour ago I posted this toward the bottom of this thread

    I also subscribe to SiriusXM so I am constantly listening to the Fantasy Sports station 24/7 and hear all of the experts day-in and day-out, which has given me a solid hold on their track records which tend to translate to the sites they rep or endorse for the most part.

    The problem with this though is that many of these hosts are still entrenched in the season-long fantasy mindset and that translates horribly to DFS. Jeff Mans is a prime example. He is a great season-long fantasy guru, but when it comes to DFS … put on your ear muffs and tune anything he says out; at least if it relates to GPP play (which is all I focus on). A few weeks back he outright called anyone who started Brian Hoyer against the Colts an idiot days after he was brought in to replace Mallett in-game. Whereas anyone in-tune with GPP strategy knows that this was a brilliant play if you had the bankroll to justify the risk tolerance needed of playing a back-up who hadn’t yet officially been named the starter yet on a Thursday-Sunday slate. The fact that he could not understand this logic told me he still had a very season-long minded approach to his DFS play and I officially voted him off my island as a noisemaker versus being a signal caller.

  • DatDerFranny

    I remember that… He also did something similar this past week with Stafford. He was also all over Lacy. Im not going to beat him up over being all over players, but with Stafford, he said something along the lines that anyone who plays him is an idiot.

    I know a lot of people were all over Lacy, but I thought it was rather silly. before last week, Lacy was playing 47% of the snaps to Starks 44%, and Starks was getting the majority of the passing down snaps, but Lacy was still priced like a borderline #1 back. This was I guess one of the few times I had a great read on a situation and faded Lacy knowing so many people were claiming Lacy due to the great matchup and saying it was contrarian, that he was actually becoming chalk, but I did fear the great matchup against the Chargers. What I wish I would of realized was I was actually telling myself that I SHOULD of played Starks because he actually had a better role in the offense than Lacy, and was about half the price. But oh well.

    The thing that kills me though is hes STILL on the Lacy train. Sure, after his bye, there is a point that Lacy will be a great play when his price and matchup meet to a favorable situation, but I cant believe hes still touting him.

    I wish I could recall more examples about the guy, but the main one is he really has difficulty speaking. I shouldnt beat him up, though.

  • JEFFRAMBO

    Yeah, I just tune him out at this point due to the value of his insight or more so lack thereof. As for his speaking ability… I hate to knock the guy but he does sound like he had one too many glasses of Scotch or something before coming on air. This wouldn’t be a problem as I appreciate a great glass of Scotch myself, but my job isn’t to be on-air for 2 hours a day where I need to convey my points via my ability to speak coherently.

  • DatDerFranny

    Exactly! He sounds slightly inebriated. He sort of reminds me of the sleazy dudes who tout ATS picks with their 10000 star locks.

  • mrchuffy

    I listen to the fantasy channel quite often as well. The rotogrinders show is by far the best DFS show on the channel wish they had it on everyday.

    Jeff Mans has had success in DFS but I will agree his picks so far this year have been pretty bad to say the least, especially RB. He had Forte as his number one running back at Seattle the first week cutler was out. I thought he was absolutely crazy for even considering this let alone his top play of the week.

    The other thing that bothers me about the Fanduel Daily show is it sounds like they give full lineups out on their website that you pay subscriptions for. I don’t know this for sure since I don’t have a subscription, but it sure comes off that way. I think giving out full lineups is just bad for the industry.

  • jimmyrad

    A tout is a salesman, some are experts as well, but it’s hardly a prerequisite, especially in the DFS world.

  • stevietpfl

    Morning Grind co-host, Lead NASCAR Analyst

    • 620

      RG Overall Ranking

    • 2015 FanDuel MLB Playboy Mansion Finalist

    • 2015 FAWBC Finalist

    Jeff Mans won the Fanduel Playboy Championship for 100k, and has a few other big wins. He’s a good DFS player fwiw.

  • JEFFRAMBO

    Definitely not saying he hasn’t had success in the DFS realm or attempting to take away from his PBC win and the qualifier that got him there, but I do feel that he is very shortsighted in the advice he gives for GPP play. Furthermore he is unnecessarily condescending to those who question his advice or go against the grain and that’s a big turn off for me when you are an on-air personality. Provide constructive criticism to a play you don’t agree with, but don’t resort to flat out calling someone an idiot on-air.

    He may be a nice enough guy in person, but he just reminds me of those poker players who play such ABC poker and then berate you and belittle you non-stop when you crack their aces with an obscure hand played perfectly.

    I will also add in parting — which echoes jimmyrad — that while his personal play may be solid and goes without questioning given some of his scores, that should not serve as a blind endorsement for his “expert advice.” His cash game and season-long advice is solid for what it’s worth, but that is about it.

  • BmoreClutch

    @mrchuffy said...

    I listen to the fantasy channel quite often as well. The rotogrinders show is by far the best DFS show on the channel wish they had it on everyday.

    Jeff Mans has had success in DFS but I will agree his picks so far this year have been pretty bad to say the least, especially RB. He had Forte as his number one running back at Seattle the first week cutler was out. I thought he was absolutely crazy for even considering this let alone his top play of the week.

    The other thing that bothers me about the Fanduel Daily show is it sounds like they give full lineups out on their website that you pay subscriptions for. I don’t know this for sure since I don’t have a subscription, but it sure comes off that way. I think giving out full lineups is just bad for the industry.

    Fantasy Alarm is really no different than RG. Their writer for each sport gives their picks. Just like a guy like Notorious does on here with his expert picks.

    I signed up for a month, but don’t plan on renewing. Their site layout is pretty poor. And I’m not a huge fan of Mans after listening to him on Sirius. He has that used car salesman vibe. With that said, the guy is good at what he does.

  • FantasyAlarm

    • 849

      RG Overall Ranking

    • x2

      2014 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    • 2015 FanDuel MLB Playboy Mansion Champion

    Hey guys, it’s Jeff “The Bumbling Fool” Mans here. I believe this is my first post on the RG forums as a matter of fact.

    The thing I respect most about this “bash Jeff Mans” thread is that so far, you guy have all been pretty spot on in your criticism. I can promise you that I am not nor have I ever been drunk on air or anything like that but this week especially I’ve been a mess speaking at certain times. If any of you have listened to me for awhile I am pretty sure you realize this is not a normal occurrence. One issue for my show(s) lately is that we are only one hour yet I try and jam 2-3 hours worth of info into a show. Thus, my mind is racing while trying to pack it all in. Or…maybe I am just a bumbling fool…who knows.

    I think the original post here misunderstood my point when breaking down the paylines. What I was illustrating was that certain contests seem to result in lower paylines week after week. The example here was single entry 50/50’s against multi entry. I can promise you guys that better contest selection has been a huge boost to my DFS play over the past two years. If I didn’t explain it correctly or used “fuzzy math” I am not sure. I listen back to all my shows and other than the stumbling I really thought that I explained this properly.

    A couple other points to clear up include that I still think Hoyer was a bad play because it is simply illogical to start a QB who isn’t starting the game. Forte was NOT my #1 RB that week against Seattle but he was in my Playbook and it didn’t play out very well that week. Still, who would expect Forte to catch ZERO balls with Jimmy Clausen under center? Still awful though..

    Eddie Lacy was also a bad call although one I would likely to make again. You guys seem to be experienced Grinders and thus I know that you have to have your process by which you grade players and matchups. I have mine as well and as successful as I have been with it, I am FAR from perfect. I think the interesting points with Lacy was how much volume I played with him and that I somehow didn’t lose everything (just 55%!).

    I would discuss what I do on my website here but don’t think that is appropriate to advertise even indirectly on the RotoGrinders website.

    In all you guys are very fair in your criticism here and I understand that this kind of stuff happens when you put yourself out there. For those who do or will listen to my shows now or in the future I’ll do my best to take this stuff to heart and hopefully do a better job.

  • walterg55

    @FantasyAlarm said...

    Hey guys, it’s Jeff “The Bumbling Fool” Mans here. I believe this is my first post on the RG forums as a matter of fact.

    The thing I respect most about this “bash Jeff Mans” thread is that so far, you guy have all been pretty spot on in your criticism. I can promise you that I am not nor have I ever been drunk on air or anything like that but this week especially I’ve been a mess speaking at certain times. If any of you have listened to me for awhile I am pretty sure you realize this is not a normal occurrence. One issue for my show(s) lately is that we are only one hour yet I try and jam 2-3 hours worth of info into a show. Thus, my mind is racing while trying to pack it all in. Or…maybe I am just a bumbling fool…who knows.

    I think the original post here misunderstood my point when breaking down the paylines. What I was illustrating was that certain contests seem to result in lower paylines week after week. The example here was single entry 50/50’s against multi entry. I can promise you guys that better contest selection has been a huge boost to my DFS play over the past two years. If I didn’t explain it correctly or used “fuzzy math” I am not sure. I listen back to all my shows and other than the stumbling I really thought that I explained this properly.

    A couple other points to clear up include that I still think Hoyer was a bad play because it is simply illogical to start a QB who isn’t starting the game. Forte was NOT my #1 RB that week against Seattle but he was in my Playbook and it didn’t play out very well that week. Still, who would expect Forte to catch ZERO balls with Jimmy Clausen under center? Still awful though..

    Eddie Lacy was also a bad call although one I would likely to make again. You guys seem to be experienced Grinders and thus I know that you have to have your process by which you grade players and matchups. I have mine as well and as successful as I have been with it, I am FAR from perfect. I think the interesting points with Lacy was how much volume I played with him and that I somehow didn’t lose everything (just 55%!).

    I would discuss what I do on my website here but don’t think that is appropriate to advertise even indirectly on the RotoGrinders website.

    In all you guys are very fair in your criticism here and I understand that this kind of stuff happens when you put yourself out there. For those who do or will listen to my shows now or in the future I’ll do my best to take this stuff to heart and hopefully do a better job.

    For full disclosure: I don’t listen to your show on Sirius nor do I visit or use your website. I do see your name and twitter posts from time to time. However, I do recognize the cojones required to make the post you did here. Much respect.

  • MrWorldwide

    LOL, this is classic!!! I listen on the ride home almost everyday…..Good stuff. Thanks Jeff.

  • poonwhipped1

    So let me get this straight? Jeff Mans isn’t allowed to be human? He has a great mind for DFS. The experts/touts whateva you wanna call’em make selection errors just like us peons. If he was 100% correct all the time I’m sure as hell positive he’d bottle that secret formula up and take all the monies. Besides, he might unleash his HULK HANDS on you (follow him on twitter!)

  • JEFFRAMBO

    @FantasyAlarm said...

    Hey guys, it’s Jeff “The Bumbling Fool” Mans here. I believe this is my first post on the RG forums as a matter of fact.

    Jeff, as one of the most harsh critics in this thread, I must applaud you for taking the time to address the criticism directed your way. That takes both class and integrity, thus I classify your post as a text-book demonstration of how to respond to constructive criticism while holding true to your stance. So that being said, for what little it may be worth to you, you gained my respect.

    Now for my however, I still have to hold true to my stance that you were wrong for calling anyone an idiot who played Hoyer that week. It was a ballsy move without question and there is no arguing that. But if you watched the game the previous weekend and saw how disappointed Bill O’Brien was with Ryan Mallett and his quick trigger in yanking Hoyer to begin the season, you had to figure it was more probable than not that he was going to flip-flop on the starting gig again that week and put Hoyer under center after he went out and tossed a reasonably good game. So I think it would be fair to applaud the small percentage of crafty players out there with the risk tolerance to play him in a GPP to gain an edge in a medium where every edge counts.

    Had you have said someone playing Hoyer in a cash game was an idiot… I would call that the understatement of the year and say they should probably be banned from DFS for the remainder of the season. But the context was as it related to GPPs. Thoughts?

  • andrewhansen30

    • 487

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #47

      RG Tiered Ranking

    2 Shows I never miss on sirius Fantasy Alarm and Rotogrinders. Both are great.

  • kuik

    Jeff mans is awesome. Main reason I listen to fantasy sports radio. Best thing the channel did was move them from zombie night time to prime time.

  • DatDerFranny

    Jeff I gotta give you credit for how you handled the criticism. You took the higher road which I should have did in the first place.

  • Wombat

    @JEFFRAMBO said...

    Jeff, as one of the most harsh critics in this thread, I must applaud you for taking the time to address the criticism directed your way. That takes both class and integrity, thus I classify your post as a text-book demonstration of how to respond to constructive criticism while holding true to your stance. So that being said, for what little it may be worth to you, you gained my respect.

    Now for my however, I still have to hold true to my stance that you were wrong for calling anyone an idiot who played Hoyer that week. It was a ballsy move without question and there is no arguing that. But if you watched the game the previous weekend and saw how disappointed Bill O’Brien was with Ryan Mallett and his quick trigger in yanking Hoyer to begin the season, you had to figure it was more probable than not that he was going to flip-flop on the starting gig again that week and put Hoyer under center after he went out and tossed a reasonably good game. So I think it would be fair to applaud the small percentage of crafty players out there with the risk tolerance to play him in a GPP to gain an edge in a medium where every edge counts.

    Had you have said someone playing Hoyer in a cash game was an idiot… I would call that the understatement of the year and say they should probably be banned from DFS for the remainder of the season. But the context was as it related to GPPs. Thoughts?

    You seriously think using a backup QB was a good idea? I am almost unsure if this is a troll post, lol.

  • mrchuffy

    @walterg55 said...

    Forte was NOT my #1 RB that week against Seattle but he was in my Playbook and it didn’t play out very well that week. Still, who would expect Forte to catch ZERO balls with Jimmy Clausen under center? Still awful though..

    Nice response Jeff and great first post!

    You did however have Forte as your #1 FD running back that week. Maybe you moved him down later in the week and I didn’t hear, but at one point he was your top guy. Ask Joe P tomorrow I am pretty sure he was against that call.

  • mrchuffy

    @JEFFRAMBO said...

    Jeff, as one of the most harsh critics in this thread, I must applaud you for taking the time to address the criticism directed your way. That takes both class and integrity, thus I classify your post as a text-book demonstration of how to respond to constructive criticism while holding true to your stance. So that being said, for what little it may be worth to you, you gained my respect.

    Now for my however, I still have to hold true to my stance that you were wrong for calling anyone an idiot who played Hoyer that week. It was a ballsy move without question and there is no arguing that. But if you watched the game the previous weekend and saw how disappointed Bill O’Brien was with Ryan Mallett and his quick trigger in yanking Hoyer to begin the season, you had to figure it was more probable than not that he was going to flip-flop on the starting gig again that week and put Hoyer under center after he went out and tossed a reasonably good game. So I think it would be fair to applaud the small percentage of crafty players out there with the risk tolerance to play him in a GPP to gain an edge in a medium where every edge counts.

    Had you have said someone playing Hoyer in a cash game was an idiot… I would call that the understatement of the year and say they should probably be banned from DFS for the remainder of the season. But the context was as it related to GPPs. Thoughts?

    Have to agree with Jeff on this one. At best the back up may get 3Qtrs of play and that is so impossible to predict. I would rather have any other $5k QB starter who will have a chance to play the full 4 qtrs as a GPP play. Especially when the backup quarterback is Brian Hoyer

  • miggytoddbest

    • 2014 FanDuel WFBC Finalist

    4-6 daily is when I actually make a point to do actually work, kinda, and always listen to Sirius. Take my own projections and listen to Mans and Joe P. They are a perfect ying/yang.

    What show really does is help on some tight choices I may be undecided on.

    Check dem out!!!

  • JEFFRAMBO

    My rationalization for using Hoyer was that he was going to get the start and it was pretty obvious to quite a few that this was the case leading into that game based on how the events unfolded. If he were going in as a back-up then I would say yes it would be stupid to start him on the off-chance he comes in to substitute Mallett. But amongst those following the situation there was a high level of confidence that he was going to get the start that week and it proved to be true.

    GPPs at often times require adversity to risk and putting yourself outside your comfort zone, with this being a prime example of such. Had the play not have been successful, no one would have batted an eyelash toward it. But I think there is such a cognitive bias toward such plays that people view them more critically than they should. If anything, you should praise people for such plays because they are -ev in the long term when you remove bankroll sustainment factors from it.

  • cdenny99

    Support Jeff Mans 100%. Love what you do

  • Andrewfr

    I listen to Sirius regularly, and while I always catch Rotogrinders cause they only focus on daily, I gotta say I really enjoy the Alarm Show. Some of the other hosts are really boring, or they try to be funny while coming off immature and trying way too hard (if I want comedy I’ll listen to Howard Stern; if I want to talk fantasy, I’ll listen to the fantasy channel). I think Jeff keeps it very interesting while giving out his opinions and info…seems like his thing is to be a bit boisterous and blunt, but he does have to keep the listeners interested for hours at a time. I do disagree w/ his picks sometimes, and I admit there have been a few calls he has made that have been head-scratchers. Regardless, I like the way he breaks down the game of football, focusing on systems and coaches and other less obvious elements of the game. But even if he is off sometimes, he has had a lot of huge DFS wins, and he puts himself out there a lot, so I think you have to hand it to it even if you disagree with some opinions.

  • kingofqueens

    • 935

      RG Overall Ranking

    • x3

      2016 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • 2019 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    Folks, it’s ENTERTAINMENT. If you’re listening closely enough to be this critical, Jeff must be doing his job very well!

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