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  • ColonialRampage

    http://espn.go.com/chalk/story/_/id/14623271/draftkings-bans-use-offsite-scripts-identify-experienced-players

    Highlights: – DK will have it’s own scripting software and will disallow use of any outside scripts – Reduced entry limits – Some kind of designation of experienced players

    I’m interested in seeing the official announcement (probably in the morning?)

    Moderator Note: Please keep the discussion in this thread on-topic regarding the current changes DK is making. If you want to discuss any proposed changes (e.g. stack limits), please create a new thread.

  • pokerrob1970

    DraftDay BLB Finalist

    @btwice80 said...

    First of all, I said four, not six. Second, I’m not a big stacker and Vegas totals have very little to do with how I make lineups; it’s all about the batter/pitcher matchups. And there are many MLB slates that would be unplayable with a limit of two. Forcing people to roster batters they otherwise would not roster (vs. that day’s pitcher) has the opposite effect you think it does; it reduces the skill component and raises the chance component. Again, I would love it if DK lowered the limit to four.

    I have zero issues if sites can’t run games on less than a 4 game slate. That alone reduces the skill more than any number of player limits imo. I still think 4 per team is too many as people will just roster 2 sets of 4. The more you force people to take non correlated players the higher the skill component is. Maybe the answer is max 3 players but you must have batters off 4 teams. IDK

  • ComicFx

    @rocketman said...

    This seems like the sharks and computer wizards are still going to be able to use their systems and generate the same caliber of DK lineups. They are just going to have to go one little extra step. Anyone else have thoughts on this?

    Yes, everyone is still responsible for generating their own player projections and rosters. You may be confusing the difference between an optimizer which is only as good as the user/creator inputs, and a script which is just something that automates menial tasks for the user/creator.

  • dirtymic1

    I used a CSV file for the first time last week. I’m trying to do the same thing again this week to input multiple lineups but it is not working. any suggestions?

  • Riley

    RG Co-Founder

    In response to this announcement, DraftKings has contacted us and asked us to switch our existing bulk upload extension to the bulk upload tool they are now providing. They have given us until the 29th to make this change.

    The primary difference between the tool we’ve built and the the one DraftKings has provided is that they require player ids that are dependent on the slate, which just means that on the RotoGrinders side, you will now need to have a slate selected before exporting to CSV. We’ll be changing our DK salary import process and some of our Lineup Builder behavior to make the change and should have it ready by next Friday.

    One thing we will lose with this transition is the ability to bulk edit lineups, which our current extension supports but the DK tool doesn’t. If bulk editing is a feature that many would like to see, tell DraftKings about it, and they may add it down the road.

  • Johnphil82

    • 2016 FanDuel NFL Playboy Mansion Finalist

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    This will have minimal impact. My guess is DK isnt going to make this tool jump off the screen on the homepage with flashing lights saying “DK script is here”. It will be strategically placed where the casual player probably barely notices it.

  • btwice80

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    @pokerrob1970 said...

    I have zero issues if sites can’t run games on less than a 4 game slate. That alone reduces the skill more than any number of player limits imo. I still think 4 per team is too many as people will just roster 2 sets of 4. The more you force people to take non correlated players the higher the skill component is. Maybe the answer is max 3 players but you must have batters off 4 teams. IDK

    It’s not just tiny slates. There are 6/7 game slates that I would consider unplayable with such a low limit. Four batters per real-life team and at least three different teams is plenty of difference from simply betting the money line or o/u.

  • smallANDflaccid

    The tool was already there for weeks now.

  • stoptheinsanity

    So I just got done reading about the changes DK is making to try and help save the industry. Thought I would come here and see how happy everybody was about it. LOL. I’m an idiot. No idea what I was thinking. DK could mail everybody a fifty dollar bill and there would be a thread of people complaining that it wasn’t a hundred dollar bill.

  • ComicFx

    No bulk edit, no big deal on a no late swap site, news comes 5min after lock anyway.

    On Draftkings, well that makes adjusting 500 entries a long fun(?) night. DK biting the hand that feeds? Smaller prize pools coming…

  • pokerrob1970

    DraftDay BLB Finalist

    @btwice80 said...

    It’s not just tiny slates. There are 6/7 game slates that I would consider unplayable with such a low limit. Four batters per real-life team and at least three different teams is plenty of difference from simply betting the money line or o/u.

    So you feel that you can not play a 7 game slate without stacking 4 players from a team? That’s half a teams batters! It blows me away that people want to do so little work to build lineups and still call it a skill game.

  • Shipmymoney

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    @pokerrob1970 said...

    So you feel that you can not play a 7 game slate without stacking 4 players from a team? That’s half a teams batters! It blows me away that people want to do so little work to build lineups and still call it a skill game.

    Why would you want to? Part of the skill to baseball is understand correlations and choosing the right way to take advantage of them. All your idea does is lower everyone’s scores. What is the point

  • mccoolio

    I thought they couldn’t block scripts in browser or detect them being used? How is it going to stop them now?

  • SmokestackLightning

    @btwice80 said...

    It’s not just tiny slates. There are 6/7 game slates that I would consider unplayable with such a low limit. Four batters per real-life team and at least three different teams is plenty of difference from simply betting the money line or o/u.

    Agreed. But beyond that, I think we’re getting into silliness here, imo, when we start elevating our personal preference in style of play as the right and only way to do it.

    Stacking comes with plenty of risk. If your stack is off your entry is toast. If you land the right team on the stack but don’t have the best performance in your stack, your stack underperforms and is probably toast, especially if you don’t get your pitching right or other players right. If you get your stack exactly right but miss a little on your pitchers and the other players, your stack may cash (depending on how popular it is, it may not; saw a lot of strong Blue Jays stacks not getting any elevation this past year, even on days where they were blowing up), but you’ll be shut out of the top tier. And if everybody is stacking, it can create an edge for the savvy player to go in a different direction and not stack and clean up. I’ve seen plenty of non-stacks beat stacks in tournaments, I’ve also seen plenty of stacks win. If someone wants to use Vegas exclusively in their calculation and stack off that everyday and essentially bet Vegas totals, fine, but they’re probably not winning as much as the anti-stackers think they are and they’re not realizing what kind of an edge not stacking can give them, provided they’re effective in the way they play.

    I think it’s important we understand that “skillful playing” can and should have a broad definition. It at least needs to expand beyond one particular style of playing.

  • Cal

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    @stoptheinsanity said...

    So I just got done reading about the changes DK is making to try and help save the industry. Thought I would come here and see how happy everybody was about it. LOL. I’m an idiot. No idea what I was thinking. DK could mail everybody a fifty dollar bill and there would be a thread of people complaining that it wasn’t a hundred dollar bill.

    These are good changes. Since the MA regulations came out DK and FD both have been moving towards these types of changes. We’ll see plenty more of them. I keep posting this but some don’t seem to believe it.

    DK banning outside scripts and setting these entry limits at buyin levels is good for the overall ecology and industry, especially as they strengthen their tools to detect scripts and multi accounting.

  • btwice80

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    @pokerrob1970 said...

    So you feel that you can not play a 7 game slate without stacking 4 players from a team? That’s half a teams batters! It blows me away that people want to do so little work to build lineups and still call it a skill game.

    omg, I did not say I can’t play 7 game slates without stacking 4 players from a team. I said there are 7 game slates I would not play if I was limited to 2 batters per team, meaning SOME 7 game slates. It all depends on that day’s pitchers/pricing/etc. Sorry for not including the word ‘ some’ in my post, but it was pretty clearly implied.

  • pokerrob1970

    DraftDay BLB Finalist

    Anyway i am not gonna continue down this well beaten road. I know everyone wants to stack as its easier and takes up less time to create lineups and target pitchers etc etc etc and of course the sites like stacking for the same reasons. For me its just not what fantasy sports is supposed to be about.

  • SmokestackLightning

    @pokerrob1970 said...

    It blows me away that people want to do so little work to build lineups and still call it a skill game.

    If someone is stacking wisely, it still takes plenty of time if the idea is to do it right. I’ve stacked and not stacked and they both have generally taken the same amount of time and effort. If you think it’s as easy as simply playing off the highest Vegas total every day, stacking 6 in fifteen minutes and then sitting back and raking in the cash, then you don’t know stacking. Anyone who does that I guarantee is -EV.

    Stacking is one of those strategies that seems easy on the surface, but is just as difficult to consistently profit long-term as any other method of playing.

  • Putz

    @Cal said...

    These are good changes. Since the MA regulations came out DK and FD both have been moving towards these types of changes. We’ll see plenty more of them. I keep posting this but some don’t seem to believe it.

    DK banning outside scripts and setting these entry limits at buyin levels is good for the overall ecology and industry, especially as they strengthen their tools to detect scripts and multi accounting.

    Agree regarding scripts, but the limits do not address the bigger issue with too many entries in one contest. I’ll wait until the clarification comes out because this first email only addressed scripts.

  • bologo

    @Riley said...

    One thing we will lose with this transition is the ability to bulk edit lineups, which our current extension supports but the DK tool doesn’t

    Will the tool lose the ability to “Edit Lineup Entries” during this transition? If I use one dummy lineup to enter a contest 20 times beforehand, would the DK tool allow me to replace my entries with 20 new ones?

  • Shipmymoney

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    @pokerrob1970 said...

    Anyway i am not gonna continue down this well beaten road. I know everyone wants to stack as its easier and takes up less time to create lineups and target pitchers etc etc etc and of course the sites like stacking for the same reasons. For me its just not what fantasy sports is supposed to be about.

    lol I stack in MLB and my lineups still take plenty of time to create. If you’re just throwing hitters from the same team together and calling it a day you’re doing it wrong

  • SmokestackLightning

    @pokerrob1970 said...

    I know everyone wants to stack as its easier

    Not it’s not, and ftr, all I want is for people to play the way they want without people like you coming along saying my way is the only way it’s a skill game.

    Stack, don’t stack, only play guys your gf thinks are hot—whatever. But trying to define skill narrower and narrower is only going to create a game no one wants to play. Just like anything else, too many rules kills the fun.

    Don’t be a funkiller, man.

  • Riley

    RG Co-Founder

    @bologo said...

    Will the tool lose the ability to “Edit Lineup Entries” during this transition? If I use one dummy lineup to enter a contest 20 times beforehand, would the DK tool allow me to replace my entries with 20 new ones?

    The DK tool currently does not allow the bulk editing of lineups in any capacity.

  • JoakimNoah4Life

    Can someone plz explain how this works?

    If I had 100 lineups created in csv format, and wanted to lets say play 100 unique $1.00 GPP lineups (in the same GPP), I understand that DK’s new tool allows me to upload those 100 lineups via CSV upload, but what happens next?

    Do I one by one have to assign those line ups to the appropriate contests? Can I load all 100 unique lineups into the same GPP with 1 (or a few) clicks?

    Thanks (I have never used the rotogrinders or any other mass line up tool so I’m not to familiar with how this works)

  • gje627

    @Riley said...

    In response to this announcement, DraftKings has contacted us and asked us to switch our existing bulk upload extension to the bulk upload tool they are now providing. They have given us until the 29th to make this change.

    The primary difference between the tool we’ve built and the the one DraftKings has provided is that they require player ids that are dependent on the slate, which just means that on the RotoGrinders side, you will now need to have a slate selected before exporting to CSV. We’ll be changing our DK salary import process and some of our Lineup Builder behavior to make the change and should have it ready by next Friday.

    One thing we will lose with this transition is the ability to bulk edit lineups, which our current extension supports but the DK tool doesn’t. If bulk editing is a feature that many would like to see, tell DraftKings about it, and they may add it down the road.

    Thanks for the update. Very helpful. I’m disappointed and somewhat surprised DK didn’t roll out this new tool without simultaneously rolling out a tool for bulk edits.

    Do you know if DK has any plans to enable users to bulk enter directly into specific contests, and not just slates?

    While uploading to a slate is fine, it is nearly impossible to manage lineups when you play several contests on the same slate.

    On a related note, overall DK lineup management is a mess (e.g. manual edits either lock-up or are extremely slow just prior to the start of contests, it is impossible to manage and identify specific lineups you would like to use in multiple contests from lineups you only want in one or two contests, etc.) I really wish they would take the time to improve this as well.

  • Cal

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    @Putz said...

    Agree regarding scripts, but the limits do not address the bigger issue with too many entries in one contest. I’ll wait until the clarification comes out because this first email only addressed scripts.

    Most players like playing in big prize pool tournaments, and multi entry makes that happen. The MA regulations address multi entry, and DK complied with those multi entry regs like a week later.

    Multi entry needs to stay imo, but I agree with you that there are some multi entry issues that need to be addressed. We need more “Featured” tournaments that are not mass multi entry. I think it would help if both sites focused on a single entry “featured” tournament just below that day’s major multi entry tournament. Instead of having 10 different, similarly-prized single entry tournaments in the middle of the lobby put a lot of focus on one big one. Maybe have another featured tournament with a 3-5 entry cap. Then do more to communicate to users which tournaments are single entry and which are multi entry (and what that means).

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