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  • bhdevault

    • Lead Moderator

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    Monday, June 10th

    9:00 PM EST : Golden State ( 1.5 ) at Toronto ( -1.5 ) —- T: 214

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  • IronMonkey415

    Okay okay, where is 6/13 thread

  • telestraightshooter

    @IronMonkey415 said...

    Okay okay, where is 6/13 thread

    ( insert null comment )

  • tmarohl

    @gaelicgirl said...

    That seems to be the popular theory here at Conspiracy Central.
    My alternate theory is that his first injury was indeed a calf strain, but the team misjudged the severity of it. I submit it was actually a Grade 2 calf strain, which requires 4-6 weeks of recovery time. Supporting evidence for this theory is that KD has had mild calf strains before, but he said that this one was worse than his previous ones. Also, I’ve read that the team was targeting a Game 5 return from the beginning. I have no explanation for why the team didn’t just come out and say that once they realized it wasn’t just a Grade 1 strain.
    I further theorize that his current Achilles injury is in fact a new injury, as Bob Myers said. Once you have a calf injury, you are at risk of an Achilles injury because of compensation for the weakened calf muscle. More weight is put on the heel when the calf can’t be used properly. We’ve seen plenty of examples of players suffering a second lower body injury due to compensation for an earlier lower body injury. In fact, I remember hearing that Kawhi’s current knee injury is a result of his compensating for his earlier quad injury.

    TL;DR Rather than this being a grand conspiracy involving the entire organization to keep an Achilles injury a secret from everyone, including KD’s teammates, the team simply blew the original diagnosis.and for some reason didn’t want to admit it. Then, the doctors and training staff judged the original calf injury sufficiently healed to play on it. His current Achilles injury is a result of compensation for his calf muscle that was weakened due to the original strain.

    Edit: Just found this article that seems to support my alternate theory
    https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/nba-insider-tom-haberstroh/kevin-durants-achilles-casts-cloud-over-warriors-present-and-future
    “The calf is not an isolated muscle but a dynamic muscle complex,” Stotts wrote. “Playing through a strained calf can increase the chances of a secondary injury occurring somewhere else along the kinetic chain.”

    GG should get a job in Public Relations for the Warriors :)

    Funny how they can be really precise when describing injuries, like Kevon Looney has a 1st costal cartilage non-displaced fracture, an injury that probably 99.9% of the people have no idea what it is, but they have to be murky when talking about an Achilles, an injury that 99.9% of the people know what it is.

    Speaking of that, do they have the results of this MRI yet or are they waiting for him to heal before confirming the obvious?

  • telestraightshooter

    @gaelicgirl said...

    I further theorize that his current Achilles injury is in fact a new injury, as Bob Myers said.

    It’s a new injury?!?
    I did not hear Bob say that. – transcript pls

    I certainly buy into over compensation causes injury…. but the calf contains a muscle (upper calf) and the achilles tendon…hence a lower calf injury is the achilles tendon.

    The kentic chain breaks at the weakest link – the injured tendon in the lower calf is what ruptured in g#5

  • gaelicgirl

    @tmarohl said...

    GG should get a job in Public Relations for the Warriors :)

    LOL I’d take it in a heartbeat! No MRI results yet.

  • gaelicgirl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    It’s a new injury?!?
    I did not hear Bob say that. – transcript pls

    I heard it. I’ll see if I can find video, to prove I’m not lying (smh)

  • tmarohl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    It’s a new injury?!?
    I did not hear Bob say that. – transcript pls

    I certainly buy into over compensation causes injury…. but the calf is the muscle and the achilles tendon…hence a lower calf injury is the achilles tendon.

    The kentic chain breaks at the weakest link – the injured tendon in the lower calf is what ruptured in g#5

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zd5lXcuzRFw

    4:40 mark Telestraghtshooter.

  • gaelicgirl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    It’s a new injury?!?
    I did not hear Bob say that. – transcript pls

    That wasn’t too hard
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUcacTOBtTc
    Skip to 4:20 for the pertinent question and response.
    He actually says “different” injury, not new injury, but that’s a matter of semantics.

  • telestraightshooter

    @gaelicgirl said...

    That wasn’t too hard
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUcacTOBtTc
    Skip to 4:20 for the pertinent question and response.
    He actually says “different” injury, not new injury, but that’s a matter of semantics.

    thx for the digg y’all

    “The initial injury was a calf injury, this is not a calf injury…umm.. I’m not a doctor, I dont know how those are related or not, but its a different injury”

    I think its save to assume he meant calf muscle.

    Technically they are both calf injuries.
    “The gastrocnemius and soleus muscles (calf muscles) unite into one band of tissue, which becomes the Achilles tendon at the low end of the calf.”
    https://www.webmd.com/fitness-exercise/picture-of-the-achilles-tendon#1

    … but like the good man said (who was put in a very bad spot),
    umm.. I’m not a doctor
    so, I’ll take it at face value it’s a different injury which implies THE INJURY WAS ON A DIFFERENT PART OF THE CALF…. not a different, more severe injury, on initial tear.
    but if Bob was being Machiavellian about it, the different injury COULD HAVE BEEN a more severe injury, on initial tear – be because he nullified the 1st part of statement with “im not a doctor” (so ignore what I just said)

    I dont think has being intentionally devious like that, but people are like that sometimes

    yes, semantics matter to me, I’m a database analyst, in my world a misplaced semicolon(;) can cause a catastrophic server crash, so I OCD on what words mean and what people really mean when they use them… especially if they think they know what they mean when they really don’tKnowWhatInTheHellTheyAreTalkingAbout!
    =)

  • gaelicgirl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    I think its save to assume he meant calf muscle.

    Agreed.

  • tmarohl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    thx for the digg y’all

    “The initial injury was a calf injury, this is not a calf injury…umm.. I’m not a doctor, I dont know how those are related or not, but its a different injury”

    I think its save to assume he meant calf muscle.

    Technically they are both calf injuries.
    “The gastrocnemius and soleus muscles (calf muscles) unite into one band of tissue, which becomes the Achilles tendon at the low end of the calf.”
    https://www.webmd.com/fitness-exercise/picture-of-the-achilles-tendon#1

    … but like the good man said (who was put in a very bad spot),
    umm.. I’m not a doctor
    so, I’ll take it at face value it’s a different injury which implies THE INJURY WAS ON A DIFFERENT PART OF THE CALF…. not a different, more severe injury, on initial tear.
    but if Bob was being Machiavellian about it, the different injury COULD HAVE BEEN a more severe injury, on initial tear – be because he nullified the 1st part of statement with “im not a doctor” (so ignore what I just said)

    I dont think has being intentionally devious like that, but people are like that sometimes

    yes, semantics matter to me, I’m a database analyst, in my world a misplaced semicolon(;) can cause a catastrophic server crash, so I OCD on what words mean and what people really mean when they use them… especially if they think they know what they mean when they really don’tKnowWhatInTheHellTheyAreTalkingAbout!
    =)

    Never accused them about being devious about the second injury. Just that they were lying about the first one.

  • telestraightshooter

    until I see Xrays of both injury events on sir KD’s calf….
    …. I will still believe the 1st one involved the tendon area…
    ….. cause where a trainer puts the icebag matters….
    …, and every photo I’ve seen the ice bags were on the tendon.

  • telestraightshooter

    @tmarohl said...

    Never accused them about being devious about the second injury. Just that they were lying about the first one.

    I concur with that opinion, but substitute “lying” with “obfuscating” for their own interests

  • tmarohl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    until I see Xrays of both injury events on sir KD’s calf….
    …. I will still believe the 1st one involved the tendon area…
    ….. cause where a trainer puts the icebag matters….
    …, and every photo I’ve seen the ice bags were on the tendon.

    Not to mention there were reports of stem cell therapy directly to the tendon.

  • tmarohl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    I concur with that opinion, but substitute “lying” with “obfuscating” for their own interests

    What possible interests could there be in not telling the truth in this case?

  • gaelicgirl

    @telestraightshooter said...

    I’ll take it at face value it’s a different injury which implies THE INJURY WAS ON A DIFFERENT PART OF THE CALF…. not a different, more severe injury, on initial tear.

    This would be the rational take. As a database analyst, I’d presume you’re more inclined to look at things logically than to fall down the rabbit hole of wild conspiracy theories. I’m not good with numbers, but as an English fanatic I share your appreciation of semantics. Words matter, as well as the context in which they’re used. It’s hard to imagine Myers trying to be Machiavellian in the moment he’s breaking the news of a devastating injury to one of his best players. Much more likely that he was speaking from the heart, and wasn’t overly concerned with finding exactly the right words to express what he was trying to say.

  • tmarohl

    @gaelicgirl said...

    This would be the rational take. As a database analyst, I’d presume you’re more inclined to look at things logically than to fall down the rabbit hole of wild conspiracy theories. I’m not good with numbers, but as an English fanatic I share your appreciation of semantics. Words matter, as well as the context in which they’re used. It’s hard to imagine Myers trying to be Machiavellian in the moment he’s breaking the news of a devastating injury to one of his best players. Much more likely that he was speaking from the heart, and wasn’t overly concerned with finding exactly the right words to express what he was trying to say.

    Again, if you are speaking to me, I am not questioning Myers presser. I’m questioning the misinformation campaign from the first injury, and the shroud of secrecy they were operating under. No doubt he was emotional in the press conference, because as President of basketball operations, he does deserve a lions share of the blame for this injury. Come clean initially and you don’t have all the pressure for KD to play, that his team created by lying in the first place.

  • gaelicgirl

    @tmarohl said...

    Again, if you are speaking to me, I am not questioning Myers presser. I’m questioning the misinformation campaign from the first injury, and the shroud of secrecy they were operating under. No doubt he was emotional in the press conference, because as President of basketball operations, he does deserve a lions share of the blame for this injury. Come clean initially and you don’t have all the pressure for KD to play, that his team created by lying in the first place.

    I was actually applauding telestraightshooter’s decision to take Myers’ words at face value.
    Why are you so determined to ascribe nefarious motives to the way the Warriors have handled KD’s injury? Your use of such emotionally loaded phrases (shroud of secrecy!) and words (lying!) is curious to me.

  • RWilder

    I have to say all this for the last two days is ridiculous. I’m going to guess none of you are in the NBA circles. Well I am, there are some on here who know who I am, some don’t. KD didn’t have a torn Achilles injury prior to the game. It was a calf strain, not an achilles injury. I could say a whole ton more, but won’t. But time to move on. He came out and dominated for 11 minutes and than hurt himself. It’s a really sad thing and anyone who thinks anything other than that is not giving KD the respect he deserves.

  • telestraightshooter

    @gaelicgirl said...

    I’d presume you’re more inclined to look at things logically than to fall down the rabbit hole of wild conspiracy theories.

    wlid ones – no
    But conspiracies? hell, we are conspiring right now (to try to figure this FUBAR calf catastrophy), any two interactions are by definition are a conspiracy (depend on which meaning your meaning)

    Any low probable event theory is possible, it’s just what are the odds of it.

  • telestraightshooter

    @tmarohl said...

    What possible interests could there be in not telling the truth in this case?

    good question.

  • telestraightshooter

    @RWilder said...

    . It was a calf strain, not an achilles injury.

    . It was a calf muscle strain, not an achilles tendon injury to the calf.

    there fixed it.

  • tmarohl

    @RWilder said...

    I have to say all this for the last two days is ridiculous. I’m going to guess none of you are in the NBA circles. Well I am, there are some on here who know who I am, some don’t. KD didn’t have a torn Achilles injury prior to the game. It was a calf strain, not an achilles injury. I could say a whole ton more, but won’t. But time to move on. He came out and dominated for 11 minutes and than hurt himself. It’s a really sad thing and anyone who thinks anything other than that is not giving KD the respect he deserves.

    I know who you are, and you have provided some good info past years. No matter how you slice it, the Warriors handled the first injury poorly, even if you buy the mild calf strain argument that they continually stuck with. I am at a loss for why, because that organization is usually pretty good about their injury reporting.

  • yisman

    https://rotogrinders.com/threads/nba-1-27-1697697?page=19

  • telestraightshooter

    @RWilder said...

    I’m going to guess none of you are in the NBA circles. Well I am,

    Well, you accurately said before g#5 that he was going to play. – I had severe doubts, based on what a rational injury recovery plan would be. Failing a workout on Friday and getting an green light on Monday, sans a minute restriction is not rational.
    But, just as in physics – pressure does change the properties of things – like air conditioning, or detonating a thermonuclear device – or making an higher risk game clearance.

    Ok- the word in the legit NBA circles was “calf injury”. then why was the icebags on the tendon part of the calf?
    ( and just damn! KD has a freakishly long lower leg)

    I respect KD & what he was trying to do, considering the situation.

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