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  • appguy

    Hey guys,

    New here. Does anyone have any experience with FantasyAces and their withdrawal times? I requested a $600 payout to PayPal 7 days ago and still have not received it. Their website says 24-48 hours.

    I would assume these smaller sites would have a heavier focus on customer service, which is why I chose FantasyAces (along with the smaller GPP games). Apparently not?

    MOD NOTE: FANTASYDRAFT PULLS OUT OF ACES DEAL, 1/30: In an official statement from FantasyDraft, the company has said “Unfortunately, because of issues identified during our due diligence, we are unable to purchase the assets of Fantasy Aces. We will continue to provide the best possible daily fantasy experience for our users, and are committed as always to putting our Players First.” We’ll post any additional news as it’s confirmed.

    MOD NOTE (Feb 1, 1:53 AM EST): FANTASY ACES HAS FILED FOR BANKRUPTCY Initially reported here.

    MOD NOTE (Feb 13, 8:40 PM EST): HUGE NEWS VIA FANTASY DRAFT, REIMBURSING FANTASY ACES PLAYERS Initially reported here.

  • stv1313

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    @britdevine said...

    Please contact them here as a few of us spending a few minutes filling out the form will help the proper authorities get the relevant info to pursue criminal charges againt the Frisinas for running a Ponzi scheme and stealing over a million dollars

    http://www.ic3.gov/complaint/

    For what it’s worth, I have filed a complaint for the $5k+ that was taken from me. It only took 10 minutes.

    Thanks for pointing me in the right direction, britdevine!

    Everyone should do this!!!!!!!

  • Jc801

    @stv1313 said...

    For what it’s worth, I have filed a complaint for the $5k+ that was taken from me. It only took 10 minutes.

    Thanks for pointing me in the right direction, britdevine!

    Everyone should do this!!!!!!!

    Same Thanks Brit

  • theoddsmaker

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    @Stewburtx8 said...

    Again, I understand the sentiment and feel terrible for someone like you who had a significant amount of money lost on the site. As I said above, if it were to be reported, it would have to be done via a best guess estimate, especially for any income you may have been able to get off the site before they stopped processing withdrawals.

    At the end of the day I hope everyone gets some type of resolution in this Fantasy Aces situation, which is more important than discussing taxes, and probably the last thing you want to worry about right now.

    Thanks. I mean either way with tax day rapidly approaching it will certainly start to come up I’m just trying to get out in front of it so I’m not scrambling last minute. Figure it’s something we’d be able to help each other out as far as know what to do in this situation. I mean I made quite a bit on Aces and Feud and can honestly say any estimate I come up with can still be like 5 figures off. So I have to be very careful since I honestly have no goddamn clue how much I made and don’t want to cheat on my taxes.

    Seems like my resolution is to over estimate by a large margin even though I personally didn’t get to collect on quite a bit of it. Maybe with the extra taxes the government is gonna get from me they can at least paint a mural of Descartes wearing shades on the Wall in my honor.

  • breedloveboxer

    @britdevine said...

    Hey all,

    Got a response back from the CA AG to contact the FBI white collar/internet crime unit

    Please contact them here as a few of us spending a few minutes filling out the form will help the proper authorities get the relevant info to pursue criminal charges againt the Frisinas for running a Ponzi scheme and stealing over a million dollars

    http://www.ic3.gov/complaint/

    Thanks, Brit! I just filed a complaint.

  • Jcb890

    I’m honestly curious why anyone would opt to pay the government more money in taxes than they may have to. It isn’t like they’re going to refund you out of the kindness of their hearts. There is probably about a 0.1% chance that Fantasy Aces files paperwork for everyone’s taxes considering the BS they have pulled.

    Now, I’m just rambling off of my head here and don’t have any credentials to advise people about taxes, but it just seems crazy to me to pay taxes (or even over-pay!) on something that may not even be filed from a company which has stolen over $1 Million from its customers.

  • theoddsmaker

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    right, i mean i have no idea. I just need to find a better tax guy for this year most likely.

    I’m certainly not trying to turn this into a “help me do my taxes” thread. Just pointing out that those of us in this spot will need to figure this all out in under 2 months and it’s a pretty big deal. More showcases what a truly big dumpster fire this whole mess actually is.

  • gridironguru99

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    It’s amazing that this fraud has as much comments as a daily NBA thread. People were ROBBED of money. Why bother playing when you have no idea what the rules are or when sites operate on their own terms. I feel safer betting with my local bookie than leaving any sort of balance in FD/DK. These sites are NOT PROFITABLE and its widely known. They may have “big backers” but if there was a big run on withdrawals, I think the Chapter 7 flags would come out pretty quickly. Shame on RG and the “fantasy community” for not doing ANY due diligence other than “they are nice guys” – well guess what? We all got screwed.

    Thanks for sharing the link to report . I had a few hundred dollar balance and have filed a claim. I also owned stock in this turd of a company. I know where these guys all live and have provided much of my finding to reporters at both the OC register and OC Business Journal for follow up stories. I really hope you’re reading this Frisina family because I’m planning on making sure the truth is reported.

  • Stewburtx8

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    @Jcb890 said...

    I’m honestly curious why anyone would opt to pay the government more money in taxes than they may have to. It isn’t like they’re going to refund you out of the kindness of their hearts. There is probably about a 0.1% chance that Fantasy Aces files paperwork for everyone’s taxes considering the BS they have pulled.

    Now, I’m just rambling off of my head here and don’t have any credentials to advise people about taxes, but it just seems crazy to me to pay taxes (or even over-pay!) on something that may not even be filed from a company which has stolen over $1 Million from its customers.

    Everyone’s situation is different. It’s why the answer is always to contact a professional.

    If I won a few bucks on Aces and they do not send a 1099, I might lean towards not reporting it. If you won $100k and had $50k still in my account balance, well I would probably try to find a way to at least report the $50k I got off the site as income. If you won money on Aces and have multiple other “businesses” or DFS income from other sites, or are just generally a higher audit risk, I would probably do my best to report proper income/winnings using Paypal statements, bank statements, etc. At least so that the number you report as income is supportable. No one is opting to pay the government more money in taxes. It’s just a matter of trying to report proper income to the best of your ability. Getting audited is not fun and can result in significant penalties and fines.

    Just because Fantasy Aces does not send 1099’s does not mean you are simply in the clear in terms of reporting income/winnings. It just removes the clear paper trail to the IRS.

  • lionssuck

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    @theoddsmaker said...

    right, i mean i have no idea. I just need to find a better tax guy for this year most likely.

    I’m certainly not trying to turn this into a “help me do my taxes” thread. Just pointing out that those of us in this spot will need to figure this all out in under 2 months and it’s a pretty big deal. More showcases what a truly big dumpster fire this whole mess actually is.

    I would assume, and obviously you should consult a cpa, that in order to protect yourself in 2016 that you could “overstate” your earnings on FA & then after seeing how everything plays out, and how much if any money you are able to get back in 2017, file an amended 2016 return after the fact to reflect what you were actually able to “profit”.

  • Zieg30

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    @Jcb890 said...

    I’m honestly curious why anyone would opt to pay the government more money in taxes than they may have to. It isn’t like they’re going to refund you out of the kindness of their hearts. There is probably about a 0.1% chance that Fantasy Aces files paperwork for everyone’s taxes considering the BS they have pulled.

    Some folks don’t want to commit tax fraud, even if there’s only a small chance the government would ever find out. I think that’s a good enough reason to opt to pay the government the taxes you owe.

  • kame222

    @Zieg30 said...

    Some folks don’t want to commit tax fraud, even if there’s only a small chance the government would ever find out. I think that’s a good enough reason to opt to pay the government the taxes you owe.

    Meanwhile…the government robs people which is a form of fraud in and of itself…

  • Ryazan

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    @breedloveboxer said...

    I am an optimist, and I want my 9.5k back, but for those who you are speaking of, actively trying to get some degree of repayment back, how do they expect this to occur during the bankruptcy process?

    I have done more research on this subject than I ever have wanted to, and I am a Psychologist, not a lawyer.. but research is my thing, which is the primary reason I started DFS to begin with.

    From my understanding Aces has nothing remotely close to the 1.3 mil they owe players. I am sure they have it somewhere…off shore, or in a luxurious van down by the river, but what are we going to do, split the 3k and a few laptops amongst the hundreds of players?

    After speaking with multiple attorneys after hearing of the “Preferential Payment Rule” scared out of my mind that these criminals could not only owe me 9.5k, but have their trustee potentially request funds withdrawn within the past 90 days back from players, I would like to forward some optimism and good news to you all.

    Long story short, and speaking in generalities, I have been told that Aces likely does not have a claim in this matter. And if for some reason they do, us creditors could easily fight this given the many potential defenses afforded to us by the law. So if they intend on attempting to go this route, and wasting legal fees going after players in an attempt to make their criminal operation “whole”, I will gladly take a vacation with my lawyer to fight these criminals… because we do not legally or morally owe them a penny.

    So back to the initial problem at hand… getting our money back. Cal, are you able to divulge what efforts are occurring in an attempt to get our money back?

    *Edit: I somehow missed Brit’s previous post, so I have filed a complaint. Hoping others do this as well.

    there is no way in HELL that a man like the one I am quoting, owes a penny in taxes. The fraud that happened with Aces is not his tax-paying problem, PERIOD.

    I would like to add – what is stopping any other DFS site from filing for bankruptcy and getting away with stealing player funds in a similar manner? (not DK/FD, the others).

    I mean, what negative consequence is actually stopping any smaller DFS site from doing this and getting away with it?

  • skeeter1114

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    @Ryazan said...

    I mean, what negative consequence is actually stopping any smaller DFS site from doing this and getting away with it?

    Morals, Ethics, common decency, doing the right thing, being a productive part of society. Need I go on?

  • onepinrodney

    @ColonialRampage said...

    On the overall Aces situation…
    It seems pretty clear we’re not getting anything out of Aces at this point. Maybe Cam can drop back in and shed some light. Is there hope for anything from any other source or is that pretty much the end of it?

    IMO, there’s no chance of any player funds coming out of the BK, the business is broke. Any chance will come out of a successful criminal trial and a sentence that includes to pay restitution (out of their personal assets). I don’t know how these guys could not be guilty of wire fraud. It’d be nice to see them sentenced to restitution AND prison time. That would not be an atypical sentence. I’m just going to report them anywhere I can.

  • Zieg30

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    @Ryazan said...

    I would like to add – what is stopping any other DFS site from filing for bankruptcy and getting away with stealing player funds in a similar manner? (not DK/FD, the others).

    I mean, what negative consequence is actually stopping any smaller DFS site from doing this and getting away with it?

    Legal consequences. As has been explained previously in this thread, under certain circumstances (e.g. fraud), the bankruptcy trustee can pierce the corporate veil and go after the owner’s personal assets.

  • Ryazan

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    @skeeter1114 said...

    Morals, Ethics, common decency, doing the right thing, being a productive part of society. Need I go on?

    all 5 of those that you just listed, are all exactly the same thing, and legally have no consequences if one files for Bankruptcy

  • cullycat

    Does anybody know what filings FA made in acquiring Fantasy Feud in August? I would like to read those…

  • mlkurtz26

    Hello all, I’ve been following this thread. I also lost a moderate balance from FA, but only have an estimate as to how much it was exactly.

    I also went through this with FantasyHub. I can confidently say that this will change how I play fantasy sports. Gone are the days when I will keep any kind of balance on a site. Depositing and withdrawing will become just a part of the routine along with analysis and lineup construction.

    I received a form in the mail about the bankruptcy case. Has anyone else gotten this yet? The title is:

    Official Form 309C (For corporations or partnerships)
    Notice of Chapter 7 Bankruptcy Case — No Proof of Claim Deadline

    Law proceedings are far out of my understanding, but the 2 page form just seems to be a notice informing me about the bankruptcy filing. However, it also mentions a “Meeting of creditors” on March 14. It says the debtor (FA) must have a representative at this meeting to be questioned under oath by the trustee and by creditors — presumably meaning us, the players (though creditors are not required to be present). Can anyone shed some light on what the nature or purpose is of this “meeting?”

  • breedloveboxer

    @mlkurtz26 said...

    Hello all, I’ve been following this thread. I also lost a moderate balance from FA, but only have an estimate as to how much it was exactly.

    I also went through this with FantasyHub. I can confidently say that this will change how I play fantasy sports. Gone are the days when I will keep any kind of balance on a site. Depositing and withdrawing will become just a part of the routine along with analysis and lineup construction.

    I received a form in the mail about the bankruptcy case. Has anyone else gotten this yet? The title is:

    Official Form 309C (For corporations or partnerships)
    Notice of Chapter 7 Bankruptcy Case — No Proof of Claim Deadline

    Law proceedings are far out of my understanding, but the 2 page form just seems to be a notice informing me about the bankruptcy filing. However, it also mentions a “Meeting of creditors” on March 14. It says the debtor (FA) must have a representative at this meeting to be questioned under oath by the trustee and by creditors — presumably meaning us, the players (though creditors are not required to be present). Can anyone shed some light on what the nature or purpose is of this “meeting?”

    Here are a few links that provide an answer to your question… with the first being from Cornell University… ever heard of it?:

    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/11/341

    This one is much better… the previous link was posted simply because I wanted to quote the Nard Dog:

    http://www.alllaw.com/articles/nolo/bankruptcy/what-expect-meeting-creditors-341-hearing.html

    As it pertains to us, the following should be of importance…

    “Although your creditors will get notice of the 341 hearing, most won’t appear. A few instances when a creditor might appear include:
    -the creditor wants to ask you about recent cash advances or credit card charges (to find out if you incurred the debt with no intention of paying it)
    -the creditor wants to ask you about information on your bankruptcy papers that differs from what you put on a credit application (to find out if you committed fraud),
    or
    -to find out what you plan to do with secured property, like a car or home mortgage. For example, in a Chapter 7 case a car loan lender may appear and ask if you plan to reaffirm the loan or surrender the car.”

    We have a substantial amount of information pointing towards Aces committing fraud, which is why the link that Brit posted in a previous post is so important. The FBI needs to know about this. If the Trustee suspects fraud has been committed, then it opens the door for potential criminal charges to be filed against FA, in addition to them being sued.

    Again, only a Psychologist up in here… so correct me if I am wrong Lawyers.

  • dude_abides7

    @skeeter1114 said...

    Morals, Ethics, common decency, doing the right thing, being a productive part of society. Need I go on?

    Honestly, do any of these DFS sites fit any of these categories?

  • kame222

    @skeeter1114 said...

    Morals, Ethics, common decency, doing the right thing, being a productive part of society. Need I go on?

    You’re assuming that they actually CARE

  • mbaldauf

    Cullycat – All FantasyAces filings can be found here: http://www.otcmarkets.com/stock/FASDF/filings

    I can’t find anything in the financials for Fantasy Fued except this (from the Q3 2016 Management Discussion):

    “As announced in Q3, the Corporation acquired certain participants of Fantasy Feud, the number six site in Daily Fantasy Sports (DFS) for a purchase price of C$454,250 by way of C$25,000 in cash and the remainder in common shares of the Corporation. The approximate 51,500 participants in the Fantasy Feud data base are now included in the Fantasy Aces data base, bringing our total to just below 100,000.”

    My best guess is the FantasyFued financials were not included in the 9/30/16 financial statements. Hard to tell from the MD&A what amount of cash FF had on hand compared to their customer accounts.

    This is a nice note too:

    “For the nine months ended September 30, 2016 the Corporation incurred consulting and director fees of $419,000 (2015 – $62,761) to companies which are controlled by key management of the Corporation and are included in general and administrative expense on the statement of loss and comprehensive loss”

    Keep in mind that as of 12/31/15 they only had $42k cash and customer accounts (liability) of $942k. So they already did not have enough cash to cover our accounts but continued to pay themselves (aka “companies which are controlled by key management of the Corporation).

  • breedloveboxer

    @mbaldauf said...

    Cullycat – All FantasyAces filings can be found here: http://www.otcmarkets.com/stock/FASDF/filings

    I can’t find anything in the financials for Fantasy Fued except this (from the Q3 2016 Management Discussion):

    “As announced in Q3, the Corporation acquired certain participants of Fantasy Feud, the number six site in Daily Fantasy Sports (DFS) for a purchase price of C$454,250 by way of C$25,000 in cash and the remainder in common shares of the Corporation. The approximate 51,500 participants in the Fantasy Feud data base are now included in the Fantasy Aces data base, bringing our total to just below 100,000.”

    My best guess is the FantasyFued financials were not included in the 9/30/16 financial statements. Hard to tell from the MD&A what amount of cash FF had on hand compared to their customer accounts.

    This is a nice note too:

    “For the nine months ended September 30, 2016 the Corporation incurred consulting and director fees of $419,000 (2015 – $62,761) to companies which are controlled by key management of the Corporation and are included in general and administrative expense on the statement of loss and comprehensive loss”

    Keep in mind that as of 12/31/15 they only had $42k cash and customer accounts (liability) of $942k. So they already did not have enough cash to cover our accounts but continued to pay themselves (aka “companies which are controlled by key management of the Corporation).

    So they knew they were going under, and gave themselves raises.

    Further, they stated our funds would be in segregated accounts from their operational site, yet that did not occur. We have that in writing from their “about” section on their website.

    So is there anything else we can do aside from filing a complaint w/ the FBI and filing a proof of claim? I would think our best bet to get justice, if anything, is to ensure the Trustee is aware of their fraud.

    Anyone attending the meeting of creditors to present this?

  • Rabidus

    I’m curious why the guys from Feud would do that deal? $25k in cash is nothing. Obviously, the stock is worth even less. If I’m doing a deal and getting $429,250 of the payment in stock, I’d do the due diligence then. Anyone that could see their books at that time should have been able to tell they were BK. Sort of baffling.

  • britdevine

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    @Rabidus said...

    I’m curious why the guys from Feud would do that deal? $25k in cash is nothing. Obviously, the stock is worth even less. If I’m doing a deal and getting $429,250 of the payment in stock, I’d do the due diligence then. Anyone that could see their books at that time should have been able to tell they were BK. Sort of baffling.

    Feud did the deal because it was something

    Aces did the deal because they needed Feud’s player funds to continue to charade as they had no money to pay out player balances and needed Feud’s money to cover that fact up since Feud ran their business the proper way.

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