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  • Mphst18

    I am using the analysis of data to draw a conclusion and ask questions in the alleged scenario (the data is not alleged it is actual data). My views are not to be interpreted as fact but to allow individuals to determine if they feel they are playing a game with integrity or one that is monitoring for violations of entry limits and rules.

    Is this a form of circumventing Entry limits and or an alternate form of multi accounting (regardless of if they are actually two individuals)

    If two brothers or individuals take 50% of each others winnings and agree to risk the same amount every night (enter the same contests with the same number of entries) is this a violation guidelines/rule. Of note they may not technically be “pooling entry fees” as brother A does not send brother B any money for entry fees they just sum up or net profit at the end of the night and reconcile.

    They max enter every gpp mlb contest (for the max entries below 150 they don’t overlap entries (they may also not overlap for 150 but I am not digging through all that data as DK supposedly has a game integrity department that is supposed to be monitoring this stuff).

    Let’s look at 9/13 2016 data, the data for 9/6 shows the same as well and we can look at 9/20 data when that’s available: (my guess here it’s the same every day but just taking the Tue slates as that’s the big prize for DK)

    MLB $600K Power Hitter ($444, 45 max) – Chipolteaddict 45 entries, papagates 45 entries no lineup overlap

    MLB $30K Warning Track ($150, 3 max) – Chipolteaddict 3 entries, papagates 3 entries no lineup overlap

    MLB $5K Deep Mini Moonshot ($3, 50 max) – Chipolteaddict 50 entries, papagates 50 entries no lineup overlap

    MLB $10K Slider ($3, 3max) – Chipolteaddict 3 entries, papagates 3 entries no lineup overlap

    MLB $150K Payoff Pitch ($27, 150 max) – Chipolteaddict 150 entries, papagates 150 entries (I am not digging through 150 to determine overlap or not, other people are supposedly paid to do this)

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    IMO the pressure and force in this thread should be put on DK. Whether you feel this was collusion or not. Or if you care if people collude or not. I hope we all can agree that there should be clear rules of play and penalties for violating these rules.

    Without a change in the way rule violations are handled the sites invite wild speculation. Which then ultimatley lead to scandals.

    FCK

  • rainbowtroutman

    @fishcakeking said...

    Which then ultimatley lead to scandals.

    Which will eventually lead to the end of DFS

  • EC4THREE10

    DK has the right to ban whoever they want. It’s really a black eye on DFS that they are dragging there feet on this.

  • DoubleTime

    • 2016 King of Summer: August

    @Mphst18 said...

    I am not sure what entering thousands weekly has to do with comparing 60 entries to 60 entries for one slate.

    Then compare 60 entries to 60 entries, or 120 entries to 120 entries, you haven’t done that yet.

  • DoubleTime

    • 2016 King of Summer: August

    @Mphst18 said...

    I can show the same thing for numerous slates, but how many do you need ,10 slates, 100 slates, at some point common sense takes over.

    Once one crosses the threshold of rules/TOS there is no aspect of cherry picking. If you were to rob 5 stores but only one caught it on video am I cherry picking because I provide the one with video, or are you a thief regardless?

    Again, you haven’t shown 1 slate yet! If you can show the same thing for numerous slates, then actually DO IT and quit lying about doing it (and no, them each max entering and not having overlap does not show a breach of the rules).

    If they crossed the threshold of rules/TOS, you certainly have done nothing to prove it. And your analogy about robbing stores is comical. Here is a better one: If somebody is suspected of robbing 5 stores, and you provide a video of that person walking their dog, should that person be arrested?

    Smurg posted their exposures and it looked like the opposite of collusion. If you have some data, please copy and paste it here. Again, not even saying you are wrong, just that what you have posted so far IMO is not a very good argument. Also the reason I am suggesting this, is because I think it is similar to what the sites have to go thru, trying to compare line-ups to detect collusion. They cannot just make decisions based off of a few line-ups. There has to be a way to compare all line-ups and use it to show collusion. But I have no idea how to do that, so if you do, please share.

  • Messiah717

    I think the people who want to kill the messenger here are missing the much bigger picture. The story of DK’s investigating collusion is now in the Wall Street Journal and was picked up by other sites. Stuff like this continues to give the industry a black eye and invites other states to say you know what? We don’t need these games here. I would need to see all the evidence before I hang somebody but from the looks of things it seems that if there’s smoke there’s fire. Even to the degree that both brothers are sitting in on three man contests together. You’re just itching to have red flags raised against you.

  • Mphst18

    I can’t give you a bib, spoon feed you and paste 120 lineups in here all at the same time. Your simplistic approach to looking solely ownership percentage numbers and not lineup construction and comparison in addition is comical.

  • rainbowtroutman

    @Messiah717 said...

    Even to the degree that both brothers are sitting in on three man contests together. You’re just itching to have red flags raised against you.

    As I previously posted,the top player in the world asked them to stop sitting 3 mans

  • DoubleTime

    • 2016 King of Summer: August

    @Mphst18 said...

    I can’t give you a bib, spoon feed you and paste 120 lineups in here all at the same time. Your simplistic approach to looking solely ownership percentage numbers and not lineup construction and comparison in addition is comical.

    Why not? You make all of these claims but never provide anything to back them up, other than cherry picked data that supports your narrative. If you can’t post it here, post it on dropbox or whatever it is people use to post stuff like that.

    So far all you have done is twisted a lot of words around and lied about a lot of things. Your only good argument was to suggest they play the same H2H lineup everyday and never have overlap in GPPs… which as it turns out is a complete lie.

    What else I find comical, is that you always complain about how the sites cater to the top players, yet in the same breath you brag about being at the platinum level and taking money off of others that are not as good as you. Which is it Mphst? Or are you the only top player that does not get those unfair advantages? Again, please share if you have any personal experience with getting unfair advantages, because you should have by now if that is the way things actually work.

  • yogaflame

    Is there an easy way to acquire the old DK .csv files?

  • Messiah717

    Yes, and from what I understand even after that they still went ahead and continued to do so.

  • Mphst18

    @DoubleTime said...

    What else I find comical, is that you always complain about how the sites cater to the top players, yet in the same breath you brag about being at the platinum level and taking money off of others that are not as good as you. Which is it Mphst? Or are you the only top player that does not get those unfair advantages? Again, please share if you have any personal experience with getting unfair advantages, because you should have by now if that is the way things actually w

    Funny I always seem to say my winnin or losing or whether I have a badge next to my name is irrelrvent. You are also wrong on the reward level but again that is irrelrvent.

    I post all the H2H games I take in threads and those are the players you seem to think are the best of the best.

    You let me know what person I took advantage of as the only people I play in H2H are those that proclaim to be the best.

    I turned down tickets when DK offered them, I also turned down the times they offered me to enter thunerdome for 3K cause it wasn’t going to fill.

    Not sure if that is enough to please you b

  • fishcakeking

    FCK

    @Mphst18 said...

    Funny I always seem to say my winnin or losing or whether I have a badge next to my name is irrelrvent. You are also wrong on the reward level but again that is irrelrvent.

    I post all the H2H games I take in threads and those are the players you seem to think are the best of the best.

    You let me know what person I took advantage of as the only people I play in H2H are those that proclaim to be the best.

    I turned down tickets when DK offered them, I also turned down the times they offered me to enter thunerdome for 3K cause it wasn’t going to fill.

    Not sure if that is enough to please you b

    DK offered you discounted entry into thunderdome? Thats another rabbit hole.

    Could you please post any further info on this?

    Thanks

    FCK

  • pepsies15

    @fishcakeking said...

    DK offered you discounted entry into thunderdome? Thats another rabbit hole.

    Could you please post any further info on this?

    Thanks

    FCK

    Pardon my ignorance, but how much is the entry fee to the Thunderdome?

  • rainbowtroutman

    @fishcakeking said...

    DK offered you discounted entry into thunderdome? Thats another rabbit hole.

    Could you please post any further info on this?

    Thanks

    FCK

    LOL DK management is something but professional isn’t one of them. IMO they need to hire some experienced people that don’t walk around saying “bro” every 5 minutes

  • Mphst18

    @fishcakeking said...

    DK offered you discounted entry into thunderdome? Thats another rabbit hole.

    Could you please post any further info on this?

    Thanks

    FCK

    Yes last year as this is stuff they did that MA asked them to knock off. When they projected a contest wouldn’t fill and there would be overlay.

    Let me find the emails ok here they are:

    NFL thunderdome my choice of $1k bonus added to my account if I enter or 500 DK dollars.

    $1k FBWCQ my choice of $200 bonus or $100 DK dollars.

    Basically they were willing to take a 20 percent haircut on margins to cover overlay. I suspect others got even better offers as frankly they just need to reach their break even point

  • Mphst18

    @pepsies15 said...

    Pardon my ignorance, but how much is the entry fee to the Thunderdome?

    5300

  • pepsies15

    @Mphst18 said...

    5300

    Gotcha. Thank you, sir.

  • onebitbrain

    @DoubleTime said...

    Also the reason I am suggesting this, is because I think it is similar to what the sites have to go thru, trying to compare line-ups to detect collusion. They cannot just make decisions based off of a few line-ups. There has to be a way to compare all line-ups and use it to show collusion. But I have no idea how to do that, so if you do, please share.

    @DoubleTime it would be fairly, easy for the sites to implement collusion detection. It is basically a variant of the set cover problem which is well known and studied in CS. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_cover_problem)

    Briefly: a lineup is just a set of player_ids {1, 14, 3, 6}. When people mult-enter they create a set of lineups. The term **overlap/cover can be used to mean different things so I will define it; as when you have exactly the same lineup as someone else; example I have lineup {1, 14, 3, 6} and you have {1, 14, 3, 6}.

    So if you are a site all you have to do is create a cross-product for every user that multi-enters. Then, for each user compare/record the overlap of their set of lineups with the other users set of lineups. Do this over time and you would be able to generate things like average overlap and more importantly users with low or no overlap over a reasonable amount of time would be the colluders.

  • dude_abides7

    @onebitbrain said...

    @DoubleTime it would be fairly, easy for the sites to implement collusion detection. It is basically a variant of the set cover problem which is well known and studied in CS. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_cover_problem)

    Briefly: a lineup is just a set of player_ids {1, 14, 3, 6}. When people mult-enter they create a set of lineups. The term **overlap/cover can be used to mean different things so I will define it; as when you have exactly the same lineup as someone else; example I have lineup {1, 14, 3, 6} and you have {1, 14, 3, 6}.

    So if you are a site all you have to do is create a cross-product for every user that multi-enters. Then, for each user compare/record the overlap of their set of lineups with the other users set of lineups. Do this over time and you would be able to generate things like average overlap and more importantly users with low or no overlap over a reasonable amount of time would be the colluders.

    This is brilliant stuff dude. And that is exactly why it is likely that DK would never implement it.

  • Bighouse55

    Any word if DK has officially banned the 2 cheaters?

  • dude_abides7

    @Bighouse55 said...

    Any word if DK has officially banned the 2 cheaters?

    Any word? Hahaha….that’s funny man. Don’t hold your breath.

    It takes a good while to come up with your “out story” to explain away why you were asleep at the wheel or ignorantly complicit in this entire charade all along. DK’s PR might be the worst I’ve ever seen. I can’t wait to see how they spin this.

    What’s the % chance we get an “official response” before the next set of NFL games run? My vote is 0%.

  • hendog

    • 321

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #9

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • 2017 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    @onebitbrain said...

    @DoubleTime it would be fairly, easy for the sites to implement collusion detection. It is basically a variant of the set cover problem which is well known and studied in CS. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Set_cover_problem)

    Briefly: a lineup is just a set of player_ids {1, 14, 3, 6}. When people mult-enter they create a set of lineups. The term **overlap/cover can be used to mean different things so I will define it; as when you have exactly the same lineup as someone else; example I have lineup {1, 14, 3, 6} and you have {1, 14, 3, 6}.

    So if you are a site all you have to do is create a cross-product for every user that multi-enters. Then, for each user compare/record the overlap of their set of lineups with the other users set of lineups. Do this over time and you would be able to generate things like average overlap and more importantly users with low or no overlap over a reasonable amount of time would be the colluders.

    Either I’m misunderstanding what you’re saying or you’re misunderstanding the set cover problem. The application of the set cover problem in DFS would be trying to figure out the minimum set of lineups that would include all the players in the slate. How do you propose this be used to detect colluders exactly?

  • cutter2225

    DraftKings head of compliance and risk Jennifer Aguiar has held the position for only 4 months. Lets give her time to catch up on all the alleged wrong doings before making a decision lol

  • Bighouse55

    @cutter2225 said...

    DraftKings head of compliance and risk Jennifer Aguiar has held the position for only 4 months. Lets give her time to catch up on all the alleged wrong doings before making a decision lol

    lol!

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