INDUSTRY FORUM

Comments

  • stlcardinals84

    Leading RG Analyst

    • 2018 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2018 DraftKings FBBWC Finalist

    Is there a market for this in the DFS world? I know the topic has come up in the past but generally gets ignored. Perhaps the growth of the industry would make this more viable?

    I’m not specifically trying to get into the market of doing this, but I think it’s worth a general discussion.

    Admin Update: RG Now has a DFS Coaching Page Located Here

  • RikkiDee

    • Ranked #5

      RG Tiered Ranking

    I’d prefer you to give less specialized advice for free indefinitely

  • neogamer

    • x2

      2013 FanDuel WFBBC Finalist

    • 2015 FanDuel NBA Playboy Mansion Finalist

    Coaching does not really make sense. Does someone just run lineups thru you and you tell them its good/bad/ugly?

  • stlcardinals84

    Leading RG Analyst

    • 2018 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2018 DraftKings FBBWC Finalist

    @neogamer said...

    Coaching does not really make sense. Does someone just run lineups thru you and you tell them its good/bad/ugly?

    I wouldn’t think that specific lineup discussion would be the focal point of an arrangement like that. More along the lines of lineup building process, post-lineup feedback, game selection, etc…

    I get the feeling this won’t lead anywhere, which is fine. The topic had just come up before and it generally gets ignored. I had previously ignored the PM’s I had gotten on the topic. Then again, maybe the reason it gets ignored is because it doesn’t make sense :)

    Thank you for offering a constructive response. I’ve edited my original post to be a little more general about the topic.

  • MrCalzone

    Would you ever consider taking in a protege or something? It seems like it would be an incredible opportunity for us.

  • Skyway

    i think its a great idea ,1) i don’t think it would undermine rg you still need to sift through the data and other pro opinion 2)i think for beginners this would be good also and i agree not for line up const. but to avoid pitfalls ie. injuries rep pop factor etc. … its only year two for me but i think when i got started i would have ben all over a coach I M (humble) O

  • sethayates

    @stlcardinals84 said...

    I wouldn’t think that specific lineup discussion would be the focal point of an arrangement like that. More along the lines of lineup building process, post-lineup feedback, game selection, etc…

    I get the feeling this won’t lead anywhere, which is fine. The topic had just come up before and it generally gets ignored. I had previously ignored the PM’s I had gotten on the topic. Then again, maybe the reason it gets ignored is because it doesn’t make sense :)

    Thank you for offering a constructive response. I’ve edited my original post to be a little more general about the topic.

    I think the big problem with DFS coaching would be that those who need the coaching likely can’t afford it. Let’s say that you were willing to do something really cheap like $100 per month. Someone buying said coaching would then need to beat the rake and also pay off the coach before seeing a profit.

    To me there would be a much better market for building/selling projection systems. I just don’t see what a DFS coach could provide that we be any better than what sites like RG already provide.

  • stlcardinals84

    Leading RG Analyst

    • 2018 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2018 DraftKings FBBWC Finalist

    @sethayates said...

    To me there would be a much better market for building/selling projection systems. I just don’t see what a DFS coach could provide that we be any better than what sites like RG already provide.

    That’s a good point. I don’t think selling projection systems would ever get very far because that would reduce the edge of a lot of top players that use sophisticated models and the like. It may be a viable idea down the line if someone is willing to do it.

  • slcseas

    1) In my experience with poker, the real value was to have strategy and theoretical discussions. Your general views and strategies about how to build a roster. Depth of positions and how that affects where you spend, your general blueprint for building rosters etc.

    2) This depends. I think an agreement to not take each other’s H2H games should be part of it. It’s also best if you are coaching players that generally don’t play your stakes. The biggest problem I have is that I have no way to verify if a person coaching me is truly profitable unless they won a huge tourney. In poker, PTR exposed several frauds and mediocre players mascarading as pros. Nothing like that exists for DFS. I think those of you that are employed by RG or one of the sites are trustworthy because you have enough to lose that you won’t screw somebody. Others, minus the proof of earning, wouldn’t be worth the the risk.

    3) Would very much depend on the arrangement. Do I get an hour of one on one every week? Do we just exchange emails? How much value do you think you would add to a student’s game? This is where it gets a little tricky. One thing I would suggest is using affiliate arrangements. A person you coach uses your referral codes join a new site, and you get their rakeback in perpetuity.

  • thorpedoboom

    @stlcardinals84 said...

    I wouldn’t think that specific lineup discussion would be the focal point of an arrangement like that. More along the lines of lineup building process, post-lineup feedback, game selection, etc…

    I get the feeling this won’t lead anywhere, which is fine. The topic had just come up before and it generally gets ignored. I had previously ignored the PM’s I had gotten on the topic. Then again, maybe the reason it gets ignored is because it doesn’t make sense :)

    Thank you for offering a constructive response. I’ve edited my original post to be a little more general about the topic.

    I would be interested in learning how to play other fantasy sports besides NFL and golf. I have interest in MLB and NBA but dont know the games or strategy. I need help with strategy, lineup building process, what games I should be playing, and several other things. I’m maybe interested in your services.

  • beezchild

    I could see room for something like this specifically in helping people develop a research routine, based on each persons time restraints. Some people have hours for DFS daily other people only maybe have an hour. Helping people develop their routines by walking each person through how you or whichever DFS PRO would handle these varying times would be extremely helpful. Each sport would require a different lesson, and players could gain insight into where to focus their limited or unlimited time.

  • RikkiDee

    • Ranked #5

      RG Tiered Ranking

    @slcseas said...

    The biggest problem I have is that I have no way to verify if a person coaching me is truly profitable unless they won a huge tourney. In poker, PTR exposed several frauds and mediocre players mascarading as pros. Nothing like that exists for DFS. I think those of you that are employed by RG or one of the sites are trustworthy because you have enough to lose that you won’t screw somebody. Others, minus the proof of earning, wouldn’t be worth the the risk.

    The other issue to me would be not just verifying that they are a winning player, but also I would have to question why they would be willing to share such valuable data?

    To me it would seem the only people willing to coach would be the breakeven ‘name’ dfs pros, which was also a common issue in poker.

    I don’t doubt that in his heart STL wants to help people but a part of me also questions where this is all really coming from.

  • fadein34

    Every time this topic has come up in the past the person/people have been laughed out of the building.

    Everyone could use a DFS friend to bounce ideas off of. The real opportunity, especially for RG, is to have some type of convention (for lack of a better term) where some of the top players dicuss research routines, bankroll management, lineup building, etc, etc, etc. Yes, you can read this om the internet but there’s something about working with top players hands-on.

    Cal and the rest of the RG crew can send me royalties for this idea. I’ll accept them.

  • stlcardinals84

    Leading RG Analyst

    • 2018 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    • 2018 DraftKings FBBWC Finalist

    @RikkiDee said...

    The other issue to me would be not just verifying that they are a winning player, but also I would have to question why they would be willing to share such valuable data?

    To me it would seem the only people willing to coach would be the breakeven ‘name’ dfs pros, which was also a common issue in poker.

    I don’t doubt that in his heart STL wants to help people but a part of me also questions where this is all really coming from.

    I am in no way trying to make this specifically about me. My original post was poorly worded and has since been edited. However, if anyone had really serious concerns about being “ripped off” by a “name” player and I was in a coaching position, I would gladly provide a copy of my 2012, 2013, and 2014 Schedule C’s from my tax returns to end that element of doubt.

  • adnoble

    I definitely think there is a market for this. You see top poker pros doing this all the time. Hell, even tutoring in general has a market. With how big DFS is right now and how much it is going to grow there is definitely and will be a big market for this.

    Everyone wants to get better and with the amount of new people out there. I can only imagine it getting bigger.

  • neogamer

    • x2

      2013 FanDuel WFBBC Finalist

    • 2015 FanDuel NBA Playboy Mansion Finalist

    I guess I would need to see what is being offered and for what price before making any final conclusions on this. I highly doubt though there would be much interest if it was a “Premium” service.

  • RikkiDee

    • Ranked #5

      RG Tiered Ranking

    @stlcardinals84 said...

    I am in no way trying to make this specifically about me, but if anyone had really serious concerns about that and I was in a coaching position, I would gladly provide a copy of my 2012, 2013, and 2014 Schedule C’s from my tax returns to end that element of doubt.

    It did sound like I was directing that original suggestion at you, but it was more of a general concern relating to all named pros.

    The incentives just don’t add up. Again this isn’t directed to you, but why would anyone who is an actual pro making 6 figures+/year offer up one on one coaching for minimal gains and everything to lose?

    This isn’t poker where there its a lifetime of learning and guidance. DFS is way too ‘teachable’ as a one time deal. Once the base guidelines are down you can get someone up to speed very quickly, no longer really needing your services.

    So all that continues to lead me to believe any pro offering private ‘coaching’ is making no money playing DFS

  • kickr008

    I would be interested in this. Actually surprised no one is currently offering this already.

    I believe such an arrangement would offer much more than any “strategy site” could. The focus on LU construction theory, LU review technique, research routines, etc., would be more valuable than a professional posting some players he thinks are good plays. The ability to converse with a “pro” on these topics would be an amazing opportunity.

    Please make this happen!

  • neogamer

    • x2

      2013 FanDuel WFBBC Finalist

    • 2015 FanDuel NBA Playboy Mansion Finalist

    @kickr008 said...

    I would be interested in this. Actually surprised no one is currently offering this already.

    I believe such an arrangement would offer much more than any “strategy site” could. The focus on LU construction theory, LU review technique, research routines, etc., would be more valuable than a professional posting some players he thinks are good plays. The ability to converse with a “pro” on these topics would be an amazing opportunity.

    Please make this happen!

    How much would you personally be willing to pay for this?

  • y2mulder

    @stlcardinals84 said...

    Is there a market for this in the DFS world? I know the topic has come up in the past but generally gets ignored. Perhaps the growth of the industry would make this more viable?

    I’m not specifically trying to get into the market of doing this, but I think it’s worth a general discussion.

    It’s quite simple actually. If someone is making a lot of money doing something, and you can learn the playbook, there is absolutely a market for it. The same reason people pay a fortune every year in an auction to have one lunch with Warren Buffett.

    Would I pay X amount of dollars to pick the brain of an established DFS player? Yes. Establishing this market, is another story.

  • kickr008

    @neogamer said...

    How much would you personally be willing to pay for this?

    Well that obviously depends on the coach and his credentials, but just off the cuff… $50-$100/hr.

    I would prefer for the arrangement to be structured so that standards could be set and expectations met.

    Maybe the coach sell blocks of time (10 hrs for $500) and lists topics to be “mastered” in that time.

  • neogamer

    • x2

      2013 FanDuel WFBBC Finalist

    • 2015 FanDuel NBA Playboy Mansion Finalist

    So i guess the next question… how much would you be looking for stlcards if you were offering this service today? Hypothetically

  • MrFantasy

    As a former poker player I beat the games for an absurd amount in mid 2000’s up until about 2010 and continue to play as my primary source of income. I’d hate to see dfs turn into what poker did. While poker will never be “solved” nor will dfs the edges get smaller every time a rec player buys lineups or gets coaching.

    If you wanted to, I’d say you should have no problem selling coaching for $200 an hour as your a household name in dfs and I myself have paid similar rates to learn Omaha in poker.

  • Troll4MVP

    • 30

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #25

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • $1M Prize Winner

    • 2014 DraftKings FFWC Champion

    @RikkiDee said...

    It did sound like I was directing that original suggestion at you, but it was more of a general concern relating to all named pros.

    The incentives just don’t add up. Again this isn’t directed to you, but why would anyone who is an actual pro making 6 figures+/year offer up one on one coaching for minimal gains and everything to lose?

    This isn’t poker where there its a lifetime of learning and guidance. DFS is way too ‘teachable’ as a one time deal. Once the base guidelines are down you can get someone up to speed very quickly, no longer really needing your services.

    So all that continues to lead me to believe any pro offering private ‘coaching’ is making no money playing DFS

    I’m pretty anti-information sharing in general so I certainly agree with most of your logic. Having said that, there is a difference between “up to speed” and “very good.” If someone is content with 2% ROI then I think your point has merit.

    If someone is willing to pay enough it could make sense for even the best players to offer coaching, but I think for the really elite who are thinking about the long term impact of the decision, that price has to be incredibly high.

  • EMSBRO

    • 911

      RG Overall Ranking

    • 2014 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    I offer personal coaching for $50 an hour remotely or $100 an hour (minimum 4 hours) for face to face coaching (not including travel, lodging, and reimbursable expenses). I back up my offer up with a GPP freeroll (using agreed to picks) of up to 50% of the amount spent on remote coaching and 75% on face to face coaching (not including travel, lodging, and reimbursable expenses).

    PM me if interested.

  • AtGame7

    I can be totally honest here and say I would be your target market for a DSF “student’. I enjoy playing and have expendable income. I just have no idea what I’m doing, which is something that has been a stumbling block for me in most of my past endeavors.

    Seriously, nobody should think they can take a few lessons, even if those lessons were $1000/HR and be able to crush the $5K buyins, and you shouldn’t think you can “Yoda” someone into being a superstar, but if you offered something to folks who can be honest with themselves and admit they aren’t winning and teach them how to build a line up, how to select games, things to avoid and other aspects of the game then yes, it’s totally worth it.

    I took poker lessons from some of the best on-line players that were willing to give them back in the day through 2+2, it didn’t turn me into a baller, hell, I was still a long term loser but it made the games fun for me again and gave me a chance to win, that’s all I can really ask. What fun is getting your head kicked in every line up?

    Teach me how do make a lineup that will have a shot so I can watch and sweat the Monday night game instead of throwing my lineups away at 4:00 Sunday.

    Yes, there is a market. It does depend on the expectations of the student and the teacher, though. Those need to be clear from the word go.

    Try me as your first student, I’ll pay a reasonable price and I can afford it if things don’t go well.

  • X Unread Thread
  • X Thread with New Replies*
  • *Jumps to your first unread reply

Subforum Index

RotoGrinders.com is the home of the daily fantasy sports community. Our content, rankings, member blogs, promotions and forum discussion all cater to the players that like to create a new fantasy team every day of the week.

If you or someone you know has a gambling problem, crisis counseling and referral services can be accessed by calling 1-800-GAMBLER (1-800-426-2537) (IL). Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (NJ/WV/PA/MI), 1-800-9-WITH-IT (IN), 1-800-522-4700 (CO), 1-800-BETS OFF (IA), 1-888-532-3500 (VA) or call/text TN REDLINE 1-800-889-9789 (TN).