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  • eperson911

    I have been playing DFS for the last few years and I go back and forth as to whether I should play cash games. I have seen alot of discussion about the rate that you need to win 50/50s to be profitable after the rake. I think I remeber seeing the number at atound 60%. Is that true? As a low dollar, casual player, I can’t decide if it makes sense to try and grind out cash games when I will be playing against folks who put a lot more time and money into it.

    Also, I remember some discussion last season about the cash line in NBA 50/50s being not much lower than the cash line in GPPs. Is that true this season?

    Thanks.

  • TheGuth

    Yes, if you are playing low dollar $1, $2, $5, or $10 50/50’s at paying the standard rake you would be profitable with a 60% winning rate. The key there is to stay disciplined and use proper bankroll management.

  • jecarl2

    Yes, the win rate needed a few years ago was around 55%. With the increased juice these days, 60% is probably about right.

  • MrFantasy

    @TheGuth said...

    standard 20% rake

    If rake becomes 20% in cash games there won’t be any more cash games running.

  • pulsar78

    Like TheGuth said… bankroll management is the key. That 60% win rate means nothing if you go all in on one of those 40% nights.

  • TheGuth

    @MrFantasy said...

    If rake becomes 20% in cash games there won’t be any more cash games running.

    Ha, my bad…Its been a long morning!

  • btwice80

    @jecarl2 said...

    Yes, the win rate needed a few years ago was around 55%. With the increased juice these days, 60% is probably about right.

    There is no increased juice on 50/50s. It’s the same rake it’s always been.

    55.6% win rate is break-even, 60% nets an 8% ROI, assuming you always play the same amount.

  • eperson911

    Is 60% about average for a normal player? I seem to remember folks saying that 60% is about the rate that pros cash 50/50s. If 60% is reasonable, and I play $10 a day, 5 days a week for a year, that would work out to about a $208 profit if my math is correct. If I spend an hour a day on research, that would be a return of about 80 cents per hour, not factoring in GPP entries.

    For a low dollar, more casual player like myself, I think it may make more sense to just spend a few bucks a day on GPPs for fun.

  • anilprao88

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    @eperson911 said...

    Is 60% about average for a normal player?

    Obviously not. Since only 50% of the people cash, the average is obviously 50%.

  • tvsfrink

    @anilprao88 said...

    Obviously not. Since only 50% of the people cash, the average is obviously 50%.

    Not sure if serious.

  • tvsfrink

    @eperson911 said...

    For a low dollar, more casual player like myself, I think it may make more sense to just spend a few bucks a day on GPPs for fun.

    I’m a low dollar more casual player as well. For a given slate/site I make one lineup and enter it in roughly 80% double ups and 20% GPP (say a 5$ double up, three 1$ double ups, and one $2 GPP. I do well enough in the double ups to make a small profit regardless, and then when the same lineup goes off, I make more money off the GPP. End result I’m reasonably profitable without too much downside. Of course my upside is limited but that’s understood going in.

  • sgaffney

    I used to play the standard 80/20 70/30 cash and GPP. I have basically switched this year to all GPP’s except for NFL where I continued to play cash games. I’ve had more success and I also deal with losses a lot better in GPP’s. In cash, even if you know a 60% cash rate is good, I used to find it incredibly frustrating when I lost

  • Fainterj

    I play the 90/10 sometimes 85/15 in cash lineups this year. Been my best year ever after two plus years. I do play more on NFL slates sine that’s where I feel the most comfortable in and where my most consistent lineups are located. I play significantly less MLB since I suck at it. Ever since I started playing 7% every night I really handle the down swings better and knowing I have enough to make it for a good month without winning

  • anilprao88

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    @tvsfrink said...

    Not sure if serious.

    Dead serious. Feel free to explain to me how the average win rate in 50/50s is not 50%. Seems pretty straightforward to me.

  • KindGuy

    @anilprao88 said...

    Dead serious. Feel free to explain to me how the average win rate in 50/50s is not 50%. Seems pretty straightforward to me.

    To be fair, eperson911 did say normal. Not really sure what that means though.

  • tvsfrink

    @elementasrat said...

    To be fair, eperson911 did say normal. Not really sure what that means though.

    Yep.

    Clearly he wasn’t asking what the average win rate of the entire player pool across 50/50s is.

  • eperson911

    Thanks for the help. Instead of “normal”, I should have said, is it reasonable for a casual player who spends about an hour a day researching, listening to podcasts and reading incentives articles to expect a 60% win rate over a long period of time? I was under the impression that the folks who play DFS for a living successfully have a win rate around 60%, so I didn’t expect that a more casual player could realistically expect that.

  • SelfCharmer

    @eperson911 said...

    folks who play DFS for a living successfully

    60% against the best in the world for thousands of $$$ is different from $5 50/50s for a casual player…

    You can easily have that win rate as a casual player, just not at their stakes

  • eperson911

    @SelfCharmer said...

    60% against the best in the world for thousands of $$$ is different from $5 50/50s for a casual player…

    You can easily have that win rate as a casual player, just not at their stakes

    For the most part, don’t these players join every 50/50 possible, so you end up playing them regardless? Is it better to join games later in the day after most of them have hit the 250 limit on entries below $10?

  • tvsfrink

    @eperson911 said...

    For the most part, don’t these players join every 50/50 possible, so you end up playing them regardless?

    This is why I only play the largest fields possible in single-entry double ups. DK has a $5 single entry double up that’s very large for both NFL and NBA (today’s NBA is 2758 entries). Beyond that I play the larger $1 double ups that are single-entry (a few hundred entries).

  • eperson911

    Does anyone have a preference of DK or FD for NBA cash games? It seems easier to put together a line up on FD with the looser pricing, but that seems to lead to more overlap in lineups. I like DK’s tighter pricing, but I am not sure if DK has a limit on low dollar entries, so I would prefer to avoid playing pros so much.

  • tvsfrink

    @eperson911 said...

    I am not sure if DK has a limit on low dollar entries, so I would prefer to avoid playing pros so much.

    Did you happen to see the post right above yours?

  • Cityworkout

    @eperson911 said...

    Thanks for the help. Instead of “normal”, I should have said, is it reasonable for a casual player who spends about an hour a day researching, listening to podcasts and reading incentives articles to expect a 60% win rate over a long period of time? I was under the impression that the folks who play DFS for a living successfully have a win rate around 60%, so I didn’t expect that a more casual player could realistically expect that.

    Short answer: no. Competition is too high and edge is too low. Hard to peg things right night in and night out. Players have random bad and good games. Cold streaks, do not look to DFS as a possible income source.

  • eperson911

    @tvsfrink said...

    Did you happen to see the post right above yours?

    I know they have single or limited entry contests, but I don’t know if there is a limit on the number of low dollar contests you can enter. I believe FD limits the total number of entries across all contests below $10 to 250.

  • tvsfrink

    Ah, sorry, I see what you’re saying now.

  • mailnurs

    Cash games are a scam. You are better off playing gpps and getting a lucky win once every 5 years than trying to win 60% of your 50/50s. It is nearly the same score to cash and dbl your money in gpps. Just like the casino, if your only gonna make back what you put in the house wins every time.

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