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  • BPhillips44

    This is not sour grapes from someone who is a losing DFS player (which I am), but rather a statement of truth that over 90% of DFS players should listen too.

    Bottom Line: You aren’t going to be profitable, get out before the sharks eat you up and spit you out!

    I started playing DFS in 2015 and it was a blast. I loved crafting lineups and seeing how they stacked up against others. I won some, I lost some but it was fun. It wasn’t about the money for me (I played very low stakes) but rather the competition and the strategy, and if I won a little cash it was an added bonus.

    For about 2 years, I just focused on lineup building and doing the best I could each night, but as time went on, a winning lineup was harder and harder to come by. Why was this?

    To my fault, for those 2 years I never thought about the sharks as I was thinking they were only playing the high stakes, and us “for fun” players were in the $1 to $5 range. Boy was I wrong!!!!

    One night I decided to open up the rankings and started to learn the names and WOW, there they were sitting in my $5 10 man 50/50 just waiting to devour! This happened night after night, but being the competitor that I am, I thought I could match up with them if I just did a little more research

    So days and months went by with me playing against these sharks, and I would lose, and lose, and lose. Every once in a while I would place in a $5 10 man contest, but that was a rarity. But again, this wasn’t about the money it was that I just wanted to be competitive and win

    Finally, the lineup building and looking forward to the nights set of games became less and less fun as the days went by.

    On June 13th was my last day as a DFS player. I entered a $5 10 man 50/50 and was following my players periodically on my phone, as I was in a meeting. My guys were crushing it. Home runs, doubles, stolen bases, my pitcher was throwing a gem. I was thinking, boy I got one tonight! I came home, hopped on Fanduel and was in 6th place and was being lapped by 2 sharks in the Top 50 ranking. That was the night it finally dawned on me that this was a complete waste of time, and that I was never going to be able to win consistently.

    To be clear, I am not mad at the sharks at all. Hell, if you can win at the rate you are I would be entering every contest on the site too, regardless of entry fees.

    Unfortunately, you sucked all the fun out of DFS for me and I would urge those who just play for fun too take my advice, as a point will come that it won’t be fun for you either!

  • 2Slik

    Overcoming 17% rake in a highly competitive and informed user pool is a huge hurdle for everyone and even the true genius minds of the sport have to play massive volume to be profitable to any discernible amount over the long haul. You’ve seen in tournaments selecting the best players no longer is an effective means of winning as a large majority of the pool are in the same boat and have even done several iterations of pivots to where those selections are suffocating in ownership as well. Now staking is here to saturate the market even further in sharks and it’s no longer a game of skill but a sure loss where you pay someone else fees to fight rake and hope there’s enough poor saps left in the wading pool willing to throw their money away. I use to play $3 entries heavily looking at large tournaments that we’re close to not filling an hour out thinking this was my time and knowing even if I lost it’d be only be a portion which kept my money flowing through. But the lobbies continued to fill earlier and earlier, became max entered by sharks, my research become incredibly better but only marginally compared to the field which just meant more time for similar results, and then the rake went up considerably. I’ll keep plugging away as I have always liked fantasy sports and the analysis behind it but no longer do I play in hopes of winning money hence these sites will rarely get a deposit out of me when I stick to the quarter games. The sites are greedy to have the rake where it is but the users (even myself) are greedy too; Scavenging inexperienced player head to heads, chasing overlay, and insisting that the “research” they found should be netting them money.

  • Hawkeye1992

    I forget what the threshold is for shark-less contests on DK but the lower level GPP’s like the $2 Tablesetter and below are 20 entry max and you generally avoid the sharks I think.

  • emnj69

    stakes is beyond absurd-an embarrassment on so many levels for all involved

  • zpruitt3

    @JH822547 said...

    I’m going to stop once I’ve taken down a Milly Maker.

    Thats the spirit

  • KindGuy

    @zpruitt3 said...

    zpruitt3 0 X 35 minutes ago @JH822547 said… Thats the spirit Link Quote Reply

    Me too lol

  • depalma13

    @Hawkeye1992 said...

    I forget what the threshold is for shark-less contests on DK but the lower level GPP’s like the $2 Tablesetter and below are 20 entry max and you generally avoid the sharks I think.

    Sharks yes, but not their Remoras.

  • d735123

    @zpruitt3 said...

    Thats the spirit

    I’m not quitting until I win my money back.

  • BRORANNOSAURUS_FLEX

    • 31

      RG Overall Ranking

    • Ranked #2

      RG Tiered Ranking

    • 2016 DraftKings FFWC Finalist

    • x4

      2018 DraftKings FBWC Finalist

    @ocdobv said...

    maybe in cash games, but this is basically free money in gpps.

    What he said.

  • Mikeybaywatch

    @d735123 said...

    I’m not quitting until I win my money back.

    That’s right! Chase those losses!

  • madmanjayWV

    No thanks — I’ll keep grinding along in the FDC and see what happens!

  • Lipscore22

    This post says “it wasn’t about them money” like 5 times…. then you discovered you weren’t making money so you quit?

  • d735123

    @Mikeybaywatch said...

    That’s right! Chase those losses!

    An old horse racing joke, probably used in other forms of gambling too. Remember Damon Runyon: “All horse players die broke.” Needs to be updated for 21st century.

  • NIN1002

    Yahoo has quick matches which essentially pit you against someone else in a H2H format for no rake. Buys in are $1, $2, $5, $10, and $25. So, it’s a pure double up against 1 other person.

    Sharks cannot eat other sharks. They will co-exist. There will always be new fish to supply the food chain. Personally, I think if you are trying to grind it out, then 50/50’s are the WORST way to do it. If you know half the field is a shark, and you know 90% of the field is playing Sale, then you have to go another direction. Going another direction in a 50/50 is not the best plan, but if you can strike something relatively decent in a tourney style setting, that should support you for an extended period of time. I just don’t think 50/50’s is an effective way to grind it out as…you are correct…you’ll never make headway fast enough or cash consistently enough in 50/50’s. In those rare times you do hit it, you want to be in position to really cash in.

  • Yahoo302

    OP: I am not a shark and I have been profitable since 2016 playing an average of $200 a night.
    The idea that sharks are eating everyone’s money isn’t true. They just make better lineups than most. It sounds stupid, but having specific strategies in each sport that will ultimately give you an edge is what will make you profitable (and vice versa).
    Gl

  • pabloplyr

    Once Poker nerds and analytic gurus got into DFS it meant that as a average joe you had to step your game up. It’s like at work, if the new guy comes in and is outperforming the guys working there, that should light a fire under you to perform at a higher level or else be shown out the door. GPPs are harder to cash in and it is top heavy yes, double ups are getting harder and harder to cash, i can tell you im 0-12 in double ups this year, all it means is trying a new strategy and stepping up. If it means playing the quarter arcade and playing 60 different Lineup combinations to making take down a small gpp do it. If it means playing a 3man do it. At the end of the day the players we pick have to perform, thats how they win. Even if someone has 200 lineups to your one, the players we pick have to perform. Simple as that. on that note im retiring from MLB until Saturday, playing WNBA

  • Olhausen

    @Hawkeye1992 said...

    I forget what the threshold is for shark-less contests on DK but the lower level GPP’s like the $2 Tablesetter and below are 20 entry max and you generally avoid the sharks I think.

    This. Dk has plenty of 20 entry max low dollar games that are free of sharks. I’m a quarter arcade only only player on dk and I play the 1$ and 2$ single entry contests on fan duel each night. Over the last two years I’ve managed to turn 50$ into almost 900$ playing nothing but those contests on both sites. I put in a ton of research each day because I love that part of it almost as much as making money on big win nights. You have to love Dfs and everything about it to put in the time and daily grind to actually pull in a profit consistently each year. This is especially true with mlb because of 182 days or whatever it is that they play each season. You also have to be prepared to go on long losing streaks and especially if you are a Gpp only player like myself. But as far as blaming sharks and saying it’s impossible to win IMO that’s just not true. I’m nowhere near a top player but the amount of research I put in each day will definitely give me a huge edge over someone who’s doing minimal research. I’m also always looking to add new things to my research no matter how little as long as I feel it will help my lineup’s get better. As far as the RG rankings as someone else said they aren’t near as accurate as they should be. My last 2 big gpp finishes on dk came in the quarter arcade when the prize pool was 4K so RG doesn’t record those. I came in 2nd and 3rd one night last season and 1st last Sunday and on RG it’s as if it never happened. I’ve had many other top 20-100 place finishes that didn’t count due to prize pool qualifications so I won’t Start worrying about my rankings again until RG starts counting all Gpp scores like they use to 3 or so years ago. I was ranked 46th in the fly weight and around 1,200 overall before RG stopped counting every single contests. I’m a much better player now then back then but if you look at my rankings now you’d never know it.

    Edit: Sorry for the big blob of words as I had no intention of writing this much.

  • mark_james1985

    CREATE YOUR OWN CONTESTS AND LEAGUE ! ! ! ! ! ! ! !

  • kellykip

    • 864

      RG Overall Ranking

    @BPhillips44 said...

    Finally, the lineup building and looking forward to the nights set of games became less and less fun as the days went by.

    Sorry to hear it. The only reason to play is if you find it fun.

    If you don’t, there are a million other things out there to do instead.

  • aylsg

    I’m only a few years in and learning every day. Glad I was able to experience the last year of college football DFS! I feel the pain everyone has mentioned but it is just a side hobby that I still consider fun and the chance to maybe hit big every once in a while will always remain a draw. With a full time real job, I have been able to streamline my research to what I consider the essential podcasts and articles which doesn’t give me the edge of a pro, but still allows me to make decent decisions. I think my biggest mistake is not truly understanding contest selection and how to assess value. But I’m working on that. If you track it back to my initial bankroll, I’m certainly down, but not by a drastic figure. For me, this is like a trip to Vegas (but on a much more frequent basis). I have a dedicated amount I’m willing to spend and then once I’m up and playing with house money, I stay disciplined and try and make that work for me. I end up giving most of that back in the long run but at no time am I under the delusion that I can turn this into a steady source of income. I think you’re either in all the way as a pro or just nibbling around the edges for fun. If you’re somewhere in the middle where you end up thinking you should be winning all the time or you’re “owed” something, that’s when you get chewed to bits. I was heading that way last year but was able to take a step back and realize DFS for what it is. And it is only getting tougher.

  • moped_jones

    @hendry said...

    no one ever thinks that the reason they are a losing player is because of the games they select and the lineups they submit. theres always some other reason.

    I like the people that complain about losing but do no research b/c they don’t have time.

  • moped_jones

    @Yahoo302 said...

    OP: I am not a shark and I have been profitable since 2016 playing an average of $200 a night.
    The idea that sharks are eating everyone’s money isn’t true. They just make better lineups than most. It sounds stupid, but having specific strategies in each sport that will ultimately give you an edge is what will make you profitable (and vice versa).
    Gl

    Sharks make better lineups b/c they play MANY lineups. There’s not a ton of skill involved when you are maxing out contests left and right. Obviously the more LU’s you play the better your odds at winning are. If they were truly great they’d only need to do one LU a night.

  • moped_jones

    @Lipscore22 said...

    This post says “it wasn’t about them money” like 5 times…. then you discovered you weren’t making money so you quit?

    this reminds me of a story, a while back I was looking to hire a cameraman for a film I was making. While we were negotiating his pay he’d say an amount and I would say “okay.” Then after more emails he would want more. I would say “okay”. Then eventually he asked for more and I said “I think I’m going to go in another direction.” and he said “That’s a shame. I really wanted to be a part of this project. It wasn’t about the money.” Well, the money was the reason he didn’t get the gig.

    When I first started DFS I had dreams of hitting it big. Spent a lot of money not winning big. Eventually I just readjusted my goals. I want to have fun and not have to keep putting in deposits. If I hit a big one that’s great, but mainly I am just supplementing my GPPs with cash games. Like I said, if I hit one that will be awesome, but if breaking even is all I do then that’s better than losing a bunch of money.

  • Olhausen

    @moped_jones said...

    Sharks make better lineups b/c they play MANY lineups. There’s not a ton of skill involved when you are maxing out contests left and right. Obviously the more LU’s you play the better your odds at winning are. If they were truly great they’d only need to do one LU a night.

    This is such a foolish and tired statement. You do know that dk and fan duel have quarter and 1$ games that you can enter 150 lineup’s and win 1k or more a night right? If simply mass entering Gpp’s is all it takes to win then you should be rich and playing in the big Gpp’s in no time. The fact is if you are a losing player doing 1-10 lineup’s a night then you will be a even bigger losing player doing 150 lineup’s a night. Does it give good players an edge when they enter 150 lineup’s compared to the same skill of player who does 10 lineup’s? Sure But they are also risking losing much more money then the player who enters 10 lineup’s. You also have the fact the dk has tons of low dollar 20 entry max contests. So the max entry players only win because of 150 lineup’s argument is just not a good one.

  • TnRiddles

    • Blogger of the Month

    @moped_jones said...

    Sharks make better lineups b/c they play MANY lineups. There’s not a ton of skill involved when you are maxing out contests left and right. Obviously the more LU’s you play the better your odds at winning are. If they were truly great they’d only need to do one LU a night.

    This is one of the dumbest statements ever

  • sfox35757

    @TnRiddles said...

    This is one of the dumbest statements ever

    No it’s not it’s actually true.

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